I've posted before about in-law care-giving. Aged mother in law, lives in same town.
We are at the tail end of a visit from sister in law from several states away. Sister in law has been here for 3 weeks caring for her mother. A much welcome respite.
It had been discussed, prior to her arrival here on the scene, she would be talking it over with her mother, to try and get her mom to come up to her home, for a stay of maybe a few months.
This, in my opinion, is absolutely essential, as I am expecting twin grand-children, due in about 1 month (if they don't come sooner, as is the case a lot of times with multiples pregnancies). The expectant mother also lives locally here, and has a 4 year old daughter. I will be on that front, helping .. as much as is needed. And not on the front with mother in law and care-giving, and have made that as obvious and apparent as I know how to make it. It would be great if mother in law would agree to go to her daughter's home (several states away) for a period of a few months .. and allow me the latitude to put my energies where I want them to be, on my daughter who will have had a c-section .. and my grand-daughter (4 years old) and new twin babies.
Nothing doing. Mother in law has dug in her heels, and will not hear of it, going to stay with her daughter for any period of time.
What are her reasons?
In mother in law's defense ... her daughter ... I don't even know how to describe it. I will say that when her daughter comes here to visit, she all but breathes for her mother and if she could find a way to do that, she'd do that too. She is the most nervous nelly, never sit down - ever ... worry wart, do everything, all the time .. person that I've ever encountered.
A great example, as I was taking her to the airport yesterday for her departure, . I reached into the fridge to grab myself a bottled water and shut the fridge and turned to walk away, as I've done for all of my 50 plus years living on this earth .. and she said to me, "Oh make sure that fridge shut". WTH???? Like I don't know how to shut a fridge? That's just a small, very small slice of what she is ... how she is.
She is so very hyper-vigilant, seeing to every minute details down to it's finest most minuscule point, fine tooth comb, questioning every point along the way, "should we do thus and so, but maybe if we do thus and so, then such and such will happen, maybe we should do it thus and so .. but then so and so might happen, maybe we shouldn't do thus and so, but do "x" "y" and "z" instead, but if we don't do it that way then ..........", on and on and on and on it goes. And usually in hyper warp speed, as to every single friggin thing.
If her mother moans .. "what's wrong mother?, why did you moan, are you alright?".
Mother: "Yes, I'm fine, I was just sighing out loud".
Sister: "Why did you sigh? Are you hurting, are you sure you're alright, why are you sighing what's the matter?"
Mother: "For God's sake __________________, I was just sighing, .. calm down, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, .. because if something is wrong you need to tell me".
Mother: "Everything is fine, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, we did a lot yesterday, did we do too much, maybe we shouldn't of gone to two doctors in one day .. was that too much for you, are you too tired now, maybe we need to move those other doctor appointments so we won't have two in one day, is that too much for you, for one day .. is that why you were sighing .. what's wrong, are you sure you're alright".
Hopefully that kinda gives a little bit of a snapshot of what goes on when sister is in the ring directing things.
So in mother in law's defense.. I do get it, why she wouldn't be chomping at the bit to go to her daughter's home.
BUT ....
The only experience she has with her daughter, in the last years as mother in law has aged and been unable to go anywhere much, has been the daughter coming here, periodically, for periods of about 3 weeks at a stretch. When her daughter comes here, she moves heaven and earth for her mother and then some, and doesn't sit down, doesn't stop .. the WHOLE ENTIRE TIME.
Is there a possibility maybe (as I said to mother in law, when she expressed that isn't happening - talking to me - her going to her daughters .. ever) .. could it be possible that maybe if you would go to where she lives .. she'd be more busy managing her own life in that setting than your's and she would get out of your backside .. and not be as hyper-drive-vigilant as you experience in her, when she's here, could that be possible.
The daughter is retired, lives several states away. Does come here, generally, every few months .. and stays for a period of about 3 weeks at a stretch. I wish I could make a list of everything the daughter did when here this last time, but it would take up the whole character allotment:
POA along with the parent/patient, is responsible for making sure that both the POLST Form and Advance Directive Form is completed for the patient (Mom). This is absolutely a Must for when our Parents get older, and you are waiting for the next Earth Shattering Event to take place!
I know that you are right there now, waiting for it to happen, and if hopefully your husband has the power to see to it what is to become of her BEFORE directly after the "Accident" and Before SIL arrives to try to Unravel the plans he has attempted to put in place as her POA, then it will Hopefully be a little easier for him to convince his sister that she Is in the right place. And No, it is Not just a Little UTI, and that she Never has a chance in h*ll to recover from!
I would push like H*ll, to get these documents in place! It's not fair for her to hold this power over you guys!
Her Son should present this to his Mother that if something catastrophic happens and these Documents are NOT in place, then there's No Telling where she might end up, should she recover and need post injury care!
This is often the case, and many people have to put on the pressure to make this happen for their parents, we even had to do this with our Mom, in the care of our Dad years ago.
Our Mom had Religious issues (Catholic), with signing the DNR for our Dad, finally and after the Dr and all her kids talked to her about it, she relented. She had no trouble signing her own DNR, it was just that my Dad was unconscious, and she felt it wasn't her place to authorize such a thing. But she was his POA, his Wife, and back then as I remember, the rules were a little less stringent then they are today, she just didn't want that on her conscious, should anything happen, which is again, another reason to have these things done in advance. Nobody wants to make life or death decisions for somebody else! Thankfully our Dad died of Pneumonia, and no heroics were nessesary. It was very peaceful.
So ... tell me, how did I do.
SIL texting me .. I did open and read it .. it was about her husband. Of course, I think a lot of her kind husband .. and am concerned. It was an update on what she's found since she got there, and it sounds like they really dodged a large bullet .. seems the ramifications are pretty nominal from his minor stroke.
However .. he has always had Parkinson's like symptoms . as a result of the strong psychiatric drugs he's been on for decades. He has been tested and doesn't have Parkinson's but does have the symptoms...some of them.
The Rehab unit .. almost didn't take him, because the damage from the stroke pretty nominal, but they did take him in the end.. and they are working on a lot of the Parkinson's like issues. Pretty bad tremors he's had for a long long time .. and some slight balance issues upon standing .. and his gait ..etc.
So she goes on to give me the low-down on what's going on, says they intend to keep him another 7 to 10 days and then discharge with outpatient OT/PT, .. OT/PT they want to continue for 6 to 8 weeks.
AND THEN HERE IT COMES ...........
(just talking to her, opens the door .. but I think/hope I did okay .. I feel okay about the response I gave .. relatively).
She then began to talk about how stressed she is . that she is now all fouled up .. (surprise to me, I hadn't heard any of this before now) . she then goes into telling me that her hope had been to drive back down here and retrieve her mom, to go to where she lives for a while and then return for a visit here in November, to see about some of her mother's doc appts (I think the goal, as previously mentioned by her at some prior point .. her mother has a reverse mortgage on the home .. if that home isn't occupied for any 12 month period by the owner .. it then becomes null and void . the reverse mortgage and the bank gets it). The goal there being that her mother return .. so that the home isn't considered unoccupied by the owner any longer.
So she goes into telling me that she'd had it all mapped out .. that she had her mother's appts lined up for November and her hope had been to drive back down this way and retrieve her mom .. and take her back to her home for a visit and then back down here .. so that the November appts can be seen to. But that this whole situation .. with her husband and the continued OT/PT . and so forth .. that it really fouls up the works with it all, and how stressed she is with it all.
I responded as follows:
"As we told you before .. if you need help to drive that route, possibly, depending on when .. DH or myself may be able to accomodate that if it will help you .. but the other end of it, .. your mom will need to see about getting herself to her appts and/or your brother .. and I gotta run, .. gotta get on with my day .. I'm sure you'll work it out."
And with that, no further communication.
I don't mind communicating with her, with regard to her husband's health issues, ... or the babies .. or the weather .. or much else .. BUT I don't want to talk to her about her mother's well being and get sucked into that vortex.
We had offered previously .. when she entertained the notion (for about half a minute she entertained that notion) that rather than fly back from here . as she did do the other day . that she'd rent a mini-van and start on out by car . and drive her mom and the dog .. and go on back home. She'd mentioned that as an option (about half-hearted thinking along those lines). That would've had her making that trek alone (her mother isn't gonna be helping her drive) . and so DH and I both offered .. "if that's what you want to do, .. depending on when .. one of us can help you with that drive, and we'll fly back here".
That whole thing got completely nixed (I don't think SIL was sold on it to begin with) .. when MIL with her, "I'm not doing that, I'm just not ready to do that" .. that turned any discussion of the above, on it's ear.
So I guess that's why she somehow had it in her mind that she'd go on home .. ck on her husband.. get that all buttoned down .. and then come back here .. via car (maybe husband with her, depending on his well being) and make the drive, mother and dog in tow.
I hadn't heard that as any option. I had only heard that the MIL said about it all "I'm not doing that, I'm not ready to do that".
So .. FWIW ..
At least .. when the conversation turned in that direction, I reminded her that we had offered to help with the drive if that's what she needs, but I also didn't step in it with offering to facilitate doc appts on this end. Just wished her well with it, and ended the conversation.
You asked about the "event". Not every ER visit if the "event".
Churchmouse described it well. Things pretty much turn into event after event until someone convinces the person to take the next step which is usually rehab.
Then they either do well in rehab or not. If not is the case, someone then has to convince them to accept more help in the home or someone has to stop their life and move in with them, or they are moved into someone's home, or they remain in the facility where they received rehab as a resident or they reject all of the above and tell everyone "to go jump in the lake! I am going home!"
So, you see, you just can't drive yourself nuts about it.
It will probably be a lot of luck and circumstance as to when she does what's best for herself...if she's like my Mother.
The day of Mother's discharge after "the event" I was called and told she would be discharged and an approximate time. When I got there to return her home SOMEONE had convinced her to go to rehab. We were being discharged to rehab. Was it her Doctor? A Psychiatrist that saw her? Or the male nurse she was drooling over? I don't know and never found out. We were rolling at that moment to the Skilled Nursing Facility across the street. I didn't know whether to laugh or cry!
my sister and I had zero...zilch...nada...no luck getting Mother to accept any outside help. I even offered to pay for some...nope.
Mother saw it as us being controlling. Basically, "you're not the boss of me". And she was right, we weren't. Someone came along that changed her mind...finally...but it was not her children.
It's very interesting to note of the above statement from NYDIL, .. very very interesting.
One of MIL's chief complaints about being in the presence of he very own daughter is that her daughter is no longer fun (I agree) .. her daughter is very much about the busyness of the next task at hand (she's correct in that assessment). MIL will say of the whole scene, "I just wish she would visit with me, .. just talk with me .. but she won't do that any longer, that ship has sailed long ago". She is correct in that assessment. Her daughter will stop long enough to eat a sandwich at lunch or whatever .. and whatever little mundane conversation that transpires over that setting .. is what you get in the way of a "visit with me" .. otherwise, she is up and going like a lunatic, running around with all her busyness.
MIL complains of the above. And WHEN I was caught in all of the madness of the whole scene .. I would ask of SIL ......... "why do you do that, .. stop ... she doesn't want you working til you collapse .. she just wants to visit with you, sit and talk with her .. just visit .. you don't have to do blah blah blah (as I go down the too long list of things she does when she's here), why do you do that?".
SIL's response was always .. always .. always .... "then why does she tell me of the things she wants done .. that's why I'm there, to help her .. she TELLS me about the arbor outside that's covered in overgrowth and so I take it upon myself to trim all that back, she TELLS me about the so and so plant out there that is growing like wild, .. so I go out there and take care of it .. she TELLS me about the weeds taking over the flower s and so I go out there and take care of it .. she TELLS me about the mulch that looks so bad .. so I go take care of it".
I've said, in times in the past .. trying to be helpful (I've given up .. I stay way when SIL is in town, and rarely any longer even listen to MIL's complaints on the above) .. I've said to her, "those are all things that she can and SHOULD pay the yard folks to take care of for her .. and YOU can be her daughter and enjoy being with her, instead of the next task on her never ending list".
Might as well have saved my breath. SIL is all about, "then why does she tell me, that's why I'm there, to help her with things".
MIL, you go to her, .. why do you tell her .. don't tell her of the things that are bothersome to you, because you know she's gonna hop to and look after it, just don't tell her ...
MIL: "I don't have anything to talk about .. I don't go anywhere, do anything interesting .. I just happen to mention as we sit here over a bowl of cereal in the morning, .. oh that arbor out there, all that overgrowth .. so unsightly ...", that's all it takes, you mention something and it's on her to do list and off she goes.
I gave up long ago ...
Again, thought I could be helpful in trying to make each understand that they are not meeting each other's wants/needs. I gave up.
I no longer .. and haven't in a long while, gotten in the middle of all that .. I rarely even listen when MIl starts with it all .. and I certainly don't carry it to SIL any longer.
That's where my brain is this morning. And then I'm going to the church to do some things, then meeting eldest daughter for lunch out .. middle daughter and family still out of town on vacation . and then this afternoon, I'll hop in the kitchen again .. to enjoy cooking something for dinner.
I like having MY TIME belong to me!
What I don't want it to turn into .. and it would .. unless I'm a lot stronger (and I'm not there yet) .. would be a laundry list of "oh and since you're on the way here, would you pick up so and so for me .. and bring it .. and when you get here, if you don't mind .. I'd like us to run out to ________________ "
I don't want all that, and I'm not strong enough at this point to tell her no.
So I will back away for the time being.
Helping her with little mundane/mindless things while there .. things that take all of 10/15 mins to accomplish in total . I don't have a problem doing that. It's all the other ....and then to have SIL in my ear, "Oh I heard you went to mom's today .. did you happen to look at her ankles .. did they look swollen to you".
H*LL YEA, they are a wreck ... but it's not mine to manage anymore.
I don't even want in on any of that dialogue .. at this point if they swell up to be ankles of an elephant .. so be it .. I'm out.
Don't wish to be there as any capacity resembling anything medical .. and be thrown into that mix again, ever.
Reframing your relationship with your MIL will take time. When she starts in with the "would you just...fold...wash...fetch...do" you need to learn to say that you just came by to see how she's doing and you have to go. She may very well no longer have the social skills necessary to have a relationship with you. I was fortunate that my MIL did.
If your MIL starts in with her requests within 5 minutes of your arrival, simply state that you have to leave in a few minutes. Turn the tables on her and start telling her about the laundry list of chores you already have on your plate! Who said that you have to just sit there and listen to her? As soon as your MIL starts giving you things to do, let her know that that is not why you came by and you have to go in a few minutes.
If your MIL is so much of a narcissist that she cannot tolerate having you visit and not do things for her, well then she isn't worth expending the effort on and you will have to accept that you will never be able to establish a new relationship with her regardless of how much you try.
You're then into a kind of revolving door situation of fall, admission, discharge, fall, admission, discharge, until the person either manages to injure herself so badly that she's in no position to be discharged, or changes her mind and decides she would quite like to be looked after, after all; or her mental function deteriorates to the extent that her doctors sigh with relief and declare her completely barking and therefore no longer able to make decisions so that either the state or the family has a clear path to guardianship and thereafter calls the shots.
Or the fourth possibility... she gets away with it, more by luck than judgement, and passes peacefully away in her own bed one night.
Be careful what you wish for. Best to keep your mind blank as far as you can, and let what will be, be.
What happens ...??.....
I guess in a normal setting .. the docs realize that this elderly person lives alone without support of any sort, .. and so what happens? The doc advises .. the person cannot be discharged to go home. What if the elderly flat out refuses that as a set up?
That won't likely be the case here on this end, there will be smokescreens thrown up as to the well being of this situation .. (not by me).
What if the elderly person refuses .. and flat out says "NO", I am not going into a "home".
Yes. We had to wait for "the event". Mother's Dr had suggested he needed 24hr care for 18 months before it actually happened. But, Dr did not consider her incompetent. Mother would not spend money for in home care or allow them in for longer than a week at a time anyway. After a fall or other chaos at her home my sister and I would try to insist on hired care. That was met with vileness to the point she would tell us to leave or she would call the police to make us leave. So leave we would. The whole situation is maddening and nauseating just to remember. But we waited...
For whatever reason my Mother never broke a bone. She fell OFTEN!
Mom had irregular heart rhythm. She was on a blood thinner. When Dr found out how often she was falling he discontinued the blood thinner.
Mother always seemed to bump her head when she fell.
Anyway, yes. I am one that had to wait for the "event".
All it was .. a smokescreen .. to block the view of how things REALLY ARE on the ground, in realtime.
Since neither H nor SIL has any authority over MIL (POA), things will get very ugly if they don't dance to MIL's loud banging drum the next time there's a hospitalization. Neither of them will refuse to take her home and make her go to a facility long-term.
I was livid when, after that hospitalization and the follow up visits now ensuing .. and SIL on that front, having arrived here by that time .. apparent ....... I was there for one and then exited .. her over-talking .. and to anyone who they encounter .. "the UTI, the UTI . it was the UTI, right doc, right .. it was the UTI ......... that's been cleared so all is good, right?, right?".
I told SIL ... (it made me livid) .. my words, "I can see that my having sat vigil at the hospital as to the comings and goings of all the specialists and their recommendations,... all for naught .. and a colossal waste of my time .... as have been so many doc appts in the past, .. It won't happen again .. you can take that to the bank".
I said it, and I meant it.
So the next time .. DH can figure a way to work his schedule that he can be the one to sit vigil .. or leave her be alone .. and then he can figure out .. as I had to do .. how to be there for "discharge" .. when .. as hospitals work .. they can tell you they'll discharge you today .. they can and do .. say those words .. as early as 8 AM .. but it can be 4 PM before they finally get to it. He can be the one to figure all that out, because I will not be there on site. I said it and I meant it.
Or SIL can figure out how to have at her disposal .. a private jet .. ready at a moment's notice.
I don't care. No longer on me, to prop it all up, and working to find my way out of it all.
Here is how it will play out, as it did a year or so ago, with a particularly nasty fall that she took, (no broken bones thankfully, but definitely a soft tissue injury somewhere in it all .. very sore and unable to ambulate well). Off she went, via EMS .. to the outpatient ER .. scans done, etc . nothing found .. other than she was incredibly sore and could hardly get to a sitting position to get up.
There was concern on behalf of the med professionals at that point (I don't know what they'd of done, because it didn't go there) .. but they didn't want to send her home .. it was said that she isn't safe to be left alone to manage. At that point, of course, .. DH and myself both on the scene. SIL aware of this latest turn of events, via phone. And her .. now finalizing things on her end . to jump in the car and head this way (a car trip .. that at the very least .. takes at least two days . if not 3 .. with their advanced ages, she 66, him 73). Her on her end, finalizing things ... arranging for lawn care in their absence .... stopping mail delivery .. and paper delivery .. and whatever else that needed attending to. That she would be on her way .. within a day or two (and then of course, it would take an add'l few days for her to get here).
DH spoke up, "we will stay with her, sister is on the way from out of town .. and we will stay with mother until sister arrives".
At that point, I wasn't where I am today with it all, and so . while annoyed that my services were offered up without consultation .. I went with the plan.
I stayed with MIL in the day hours while he worked, .. and he would stay at night. As it was .. SIL did start out this way and then experienced some car problems that landed them in a motel for the night (not one of the nights they'd of planned to stop) so that the car problems could be resolved, .. and that extended what it took for them to get here. It was about a week . before she actually got here. Me on site daily, DH on site nightly, vigil w/MIL.
So the above .. is what would happen in the event of another hospitalization (and it's coming .. not if . but when) .. I only hope they heard me .. I have said it .. don't look in my direction .. indeed .. unless you can sit vigil with your mother around the clock at discharge .. she will be alone .. unless your sister has somehow commissioned the services of a private jet to get here on a moment's notice and that's doubtful.
They both think .. maybe more so SIL .. that she can begin again with the small things, crack the door open to the small things .. and then the avalanche that I'm trying to get out from under is all upon me, before I know it. Not .. working to stand firm .. the door cracks open, it's going to be slammed shut by me.
SIL I think, truly is deluding herself .. that she can crack that door open to Dorker's help again.
DH .. I think he has no real clue . not having lived it himself .. just how cumbersome it is to pick up the pieces time and again. He's only lived it .. by hearing me b*tch. Quite different than actually walking those steps, disrupting your life, time and again.
With no power of attorney, DH can't "make the call" unless you seek guardianship. All that can be done is tell Social workers at hospital that no one will take care of her at home if MIL discharges. This is why DH needs to be the one at discharge to hear what needs to be done, because **with all love and due respect to you** he will not believe what the docs are saying until he is there to hear it. Which DH has been successfully avoiding doing for years. And SIL only hears what she wants to - as trained by MIL - and knows that Dorker will take care of it all when she leaves....
I would be taking exactly that approach if it were my mom .. not a doubt in my mind. I would NOT be running behind picking up all the broken pieces repeatedly. She would be forced to make a decision that she has to go where there is more supervised care, because I would NOT be running to her rescue, to pick her up off the floor (911 would be called, and let the med professionals assess the fact that this person isn't able to manage) .......... I would not be sitting vigil at the hospital .. and over-talking all the follow up visits to convince that it was a UTI .. she'd be left to her own ... I'd go visit her and have coffee .. bring her lunch ... but I would not be taking the approach they do.
It will be interesting .. to watch from afar .. as the saga continues .. will DH step to . and run after and rescue .. being pulled off of jobs and his church work he so enjoys .. continually .. an almost daily occurrence when things deteriorate and MIL begins sliding off that cliff time and again . Will he step to . or will he hit a wall with it.
I really don't know, to be honest. We haven't been there. He's had me as the buffer to the above. Til now.
"It's going to be heartbreaking to me to have to make that call at some point, and it will be very ugly .. it will get so ugly if I have to make that call ...".
I responded: "You are looking at it from the prism of doing something TO your mother, rather than doing something FOR your mother ... your obligation as a child of her's is to look after her welfare and well being and when she becomes child like and can no longer make decisions that manage her own well being, for herself .. you have to look at what you can do FOR HER to help that situation .. it's not what you are doing TO her".
He said, (with a lot of sadness at this point) "I swear if she falls again .. if I"m over there having to pick her up off the floor and take down the door to get to her .. one more time .. that's it .. . I'm making the call .. she goes to where she can be looked after ... ".
I said: "Your sister will run interference on that".
He said: "Then sister can come get her".
I said, "Your mother doesn't want to go .. anywhere ...".
He said: "Well that .. it may be when I have to make the tough call on it all".
I didn't even bother to ask what they've done to look into what options there would be (because I know the options are few and they've done nothing .. opting instead to let the inevitable take it's course). Not even gonna argue those points.
They have a steep steep .. maybe even impossible .. learning curve ahead, both he and his sister.
DH and SIL have been trained and trained you to say how high when MIL says jump. Until you really say NO when called upon, they don't believe that MIL is not the center of your universe still. It will get ugly. It's sad, but there is nothing you can do about this. My MIL is now getting care she needs, but if she could possibly get me to be up there stepnfetchn, she would. I shut that down fast just before they moved here. Her mistake was pushing FIL to buy a house that was cheaper 60 miles away. I work so I've been able to argue that the 2.5 hours commute was impossible:) otherwise, it would have been your list of chores. Just keep working on your house, your joint business with DH, and your grandkids.
It's kinda like, almost .. if you have a friend in an abusive relationship and her s/o is beating the h*ll out of her routinely and you advise, offer shelter, .... over and over .. and then you finally get to the point, when you see her return .. continually .. you have to back up from it all, can't be a part of what is a "twisted" situation that you can't change.
Executive level functioning. I don't think MIL has the wherewithal to be able to form lists and categorize those lists into who does what. And as you pointed out, your mother also .. at one point .. had enough witts about her that if a storm blew through .. it may be a bit before the clean up occurs and she was patient. Not so here.
Interesting morning ..
Have you guys ever seen a scenario .. I know you have where you back up and wait for the "fall" or the major catastrophe. Yep. We've talked about that. But have you guys ever seen the scenario where that is the approach .. yet the pieces that continually break . are propped up all along the way .. continually. Has anyone here ever seen that? That the "rescuers" .. continue "rescuing" . in spite of the fact that it has become wholesale more than can be managed.
That appears to be the approach here, .. even still .. by SIL and DH. Wait for the catastrophe that will surely come. Wait for the (hopefully) day that MIL herself decides . enough is enough .. I can't manage anymore, and with the full knowledge that day may never come, and it may be the major calamity that turns the whole thing.
Even still .... in spite of it all .. it does appear that is their approach.
I do realize .. DH has had all along in this ... a buffer, in me. And he hasn't been in the step'n'fetchit role (fix it role, yes .. but not the step'n'fetchit role), that has been me. Buffering him from the monumental task of continuing to pick up the broken pieces as it all comes apart, time and again. Until now. As I work to stand firm, .. and stay over here .. and let them figure it out.
That may change ... who knows ... as things go forward here and DH finds himself squarely planted in that rescuer role that I played for so long .. and the constant demand .. he may change that approach .. maybe he won't .. I don't know. I stay out of the whole thing .. and say little, since I have made my stance clear. I'm out.
Just interesting this morning...
DH calling his mom, just a ck-in .. see how she's doing. She apparently working to get herself some b'fast . in advance of the arrival of some portion of the at home health are providers that have been assigned. And her beefing about the whole thing to DH. Her words that he shared with me, "This whole thing is just too much .. I don't want any of this .. it's like a dog and pony show here and I'm expected to jump through all these hoops .. it's just too much".
I heard him tell her, "Mother it's to your benefit that these people come and help you".
She then, ........... I suppose (and as DH defined it to me, after the call was ended) .. I guess caught herself and her negativity and began backtracking .. "oh I know, and I must do all that I can to help myself and I will do it".
DH finished talking with her, to let her get on past her b'fast so that she can then be ready to welcome whichever of the home healthcare team is visiting this morning.
He got off the phone and said to me (that which I already surmised just in listening to his end of the conversation)....... his words, "They're on the way out .. the home healthcare folks that have been set up ... she's gonna send them packing .. like she always does".
Him continuing to talk, me just listening: "Ya know, I don't know why it's such a big deal for her .. that she makes it this big problem . .. so get your b'fast .. and just answer the door, let them in .. do what you need to do .. it's not that big of a deal, if it were me, that's what I'd do".
He goes on to say: "I don't know why she even tells us that she's fed up with it .. and doesn't want to do it, she knows that's gonna bring upon her some consternation and scolding that we will fuss at her, she knows that .. she shouldn't even tell us, and just go on and do what she wants to do, and just don't tell us".
At that, I did say to him: "I know you don't want to hear it, but I will tell you anyway .. your mother has a loss of executive function .. you need to read about what that is .. and how that works in people who are functioning as they should ... it's the very reason that she tells all of us .. flat out tells us .. that she isn't eating right ... she knows d*mn well .. or someone with executive level function in tact .. they know that's going to bring a flurry of worry and all coming at her, .. why aren't you eating, you can't do that, you'll get weak .. you have to eat, why aren't you eating your frozen dinners .. what's the problem, do you not feel well". And then she gets upset with all of us for all the worry coming at her. She doesn't have the capability in her brain any longer to understand cause/effect .. she tells us things she should know will bring consternation . and then suffers that consternation . but still .. continues to tell us ... same as when she tells us .. that she's not taking her Lasix .. she knows that too will bring that same consternation and scolding .. time and again . she should know .. those that have the ability to function normally as to cause/effect .. and sequencing of order of things .. they know .. if they don't take the med .. the result will be ________________ and so they do so .. but she doesn't have that any longer ...that's what you're seeing in her telling you .. now making noise that she's ready to send the home healthcare folks packing ... done with it. She knows .. should know .. the sequence of things .. that they are there to her benefit .. that it's helpful that she participate in same .. but she fails to realize that .. and even fails to realize that scolding and cautioning that will be ongoing from her kids .. if she tells you the truth.
Also went on to explain to him just how much of a struggle it is, probably more than she can manage, to appear to be firing on all cylinders . it's the reason she isolates so much .. it's the reason she doesn't want these "professionals" on the scene .. and assessing the goings on .. she has to "compensate" and make sure all appears normal .. and it will be caught .. if they are on the scene long enough .. that she doesn't manage .. it's a real struggle for her .. maybe not even possible .. that she work to make things appear "normal" as to her level of managing her well being. She is going to dispense with them, .. because she doesn't want it "seen" that she in fact, doesn't manage.
He listened. He then said: "I guess .. I hope the day will come that she says . enough is enough .. I can't manage", . and then .. we will see what to do at that point .. (shaking his head in dismay at this point) but that may never come ... it may be the major catastrophe that forces our hand in it all.
I then said, "that's what I can no longer be a party to, .. I just can't ... it takes too much propping up .. to let this thing play out and I don't want the responsibility of a major catastrophe on my hands . even though you guys make the conscious decision that may be what it takes .. it's not a stance I agree with .. at all .. you need look no further than how she does indeed "manage" as long as your sister is there, on site .. cooking for her, .. doing her dishes .. running the numerous errands .. making sure her meds are taken .. and on time .. and making sure she hydrates . nutrition is seen to .. she does well .... if an outsider were looking in at it all, with an objective eye . the conclusion would be... she needs more supervised care ..
He said: (he was just beefing, I know him .. he won't do it) .. "Makes me want to, the next time she calls . that her ankles are swelling and she hasn't been taking her diuretic .. I just want to tell her, .. well tough *hit mother .. deal with it .. call your doc, I don't know .. I'm working here .. figure it out".
He then began to talk about has nasty and vile she'd been when hospitalized .. and when he'd tried to gingerly approach her about alternatives .. and she had gotten really vile with him and told him as a child would do, "then I won't ask you anymore, you can bet I won't call you again when I have a problem". He said, "I'd like to remind her the next time ... no mom .. remember, you said you won't call me anymore .. that's what you said .. because I tried to suggest to you that you need more help .. you got ugly and told me that you won't call me anymore .. so .. there ya go, deal with it".
He then said: "But you know . that would go over like a lead balloon she would then have me in the category of my brother that is estranged from the family .. and I'd be an outcast for taking that approach".
He wouldn't do that anyway .. so no point in debating the merits and pitfalls of the above ..
You could tell that he was experiencing the frustration of watching her in what are the beginning stages of .. she will dispense with these home healthcare folks that have been assigned .. in pretty short order .. and all the while with the mantra she cites often: "Now I know what I need to do here and I will do it, I will manage".
The frustration he was experiencing . he knows .. he sees it, has seen it before. The only difference this time will be that as the pieces begin to fall apart .. as they always do . . in her failure to manage .. it will be him called upon to put the pieces back together .. and repeatedly .. as I have been.
As people age, there are more things they need help doing. My mother started keeping three separate lists on her kitchen table, one for me, one for SIL and one for my brother. ( there was no list for youngest brother, who lived further away, but he got asked to do chores, too).
So, that's what we all thought of them as...chores. Just like when we were kids.
Now, my mom is /was a very organized person, so this approach, of keeping track of what she needed, what she wanted to tell us, etc., was quite well thought out and planful, and we did this stuff as a matter of course.
And we each had a "role"...SIL does finance, I do medical and my brother does the heavy lifting. Neither she nor we think of it as " doing a favor". We do it because it's reasonable stuff for a parent to ask for help with.
I think the difference for all of you is that MIL refuses to simplify her life at all and makes so many other demands that what are actually small chores become burdensome. My mother, for example, had regular yard people, a cleaning service and had her groceries delivered. She also was able to recognize that cleanup after a storm was something that would be gotten to " eventually". She was never demanding.
Until she suddenly started having an emergency every day. Something changed ( we know in retrospect that she had a stroke) which brought on Mild Cognitive Impairment. And all of that rationality and planfulness went out the window.
So, I think that you've got both things going on in MIL. You've got the " more help needed" that goes along with normal aging and you've got a loss of executive functioning. You might want to find an article on that.
Going to be a little difficult with her. If you can picture it .. she has so become the "needy" ilk, it's like she sees you coming, and the brain goes to auto pilot as to what it is that you can do for her ... she begins to go down the littany .. like you couldn't possibly be there just to visit .. she begins listing things. "If you wouldn't mind, .. .would you fold those clothes for me, .. would you let the dog out, would you go get the dog a treat, do you mind washing the dog for me, would you get me a glass of water, can you look at this bill and tell me what you think, since you're coming this way would you stop at the store and get me blah blah blah, when you come this way can you take me to ________________".
On and on it goes. None of which .. are necessarily problematic .. but I am trying to step away from being someone who "meets all the need".
(SIGH) As DH says of her (and kind of mockingly) ........ there are times when he goes there expressly to fix something. But other times, he goes there, for nothing but to visit . that's the whole reason he's there, and his words that he *mocks* that she says: "Would you want to do me a favor'. Says it almost every time.
It's kinda like she no longer has that "skill" of being able to just visit with someone (is that even a skill?).
Will have to give it some thought as I kinda give it all some time here and back away.
You asked what a "normal" relationship with MIL looks like. I think I had a good relationship with my MIL, who is now deceased. I can say that I was honest with her about what I saw her needs to be and what she did that jeopardized her well being. She and I spent a lot of time together. We took many vacations together even as things got difficult. I drove her to the beauty parlor. I visited regularly. I cooked meals. I did her grocery shopping when she no longer could. So for what it's worth, it sounds like you can establish a new relationship with your MIL based on honesty.
I sometimes brought my MIL flowers for no reason just because I thought they were pretty and wanted her to have them. I would sit and chat for 30 minutes and then take my leave. I also brought chocolates, pastries, and books on tape. Good luck.
I'd be dumbstruck, more than likely. So no, .. will leave well enough alone for the time-being.
You sound so strong!
Tread carefully.
We are here in the corner rooting for you!
Hello, Mother, I just stopped in to see how you are doing. You look so nice with your hair just done - I'm so impressed they were able to do such a fine job here in the salon (at Assisted Living). They think of everything. I heard from So and So this week, just back from vacation. Did you ever go to Mt. Ranier? So daring to climb to the top! Here are your magazines from last week's mail (that comes to our house now). We've paid all the bills so you don't have to worry about a thing. Oh, look at the time - it's time for the movie here (at the assisted living). I've always wanted to see that! Let's go! I'll push your chair. Who do you want to sit with in case I have to leave early? Daughter might message me that she has an emergency with one of the babies, and I always have to think of them!
It's been much nicer for me to visit mthr in the memory care where I am not responsible for anything except visiting and bringing gifts, not needs.
You say you are giving SIL one more warning about you not doing anything for MIL, that you will call her and tell her. That's not the point. You said it - DH said it. You acted on it. She can hear it in your actions. You don't need to say it one more time, or twenty more times. You are done. If she did not listen to either of you, and see how much you helped her, then shame on her. But don't waste your breath. Just dream of when you can go visit MIL in peace.
I think of previously when the only thing you could get in the way of interaction with him on that topic was along the lines of, "She's a fighter .. she just wants to stay in her home .. and I'm going to do whatever I have to, to help her do that .... she's just fiercely independent".
Good that there has been some recognition of the fact that .. while she may be stubborn and a fiercely independent old cuss ... there was a time when that spirit probably served her well. No longer so.
Now .. do something about it? That has yet to be seen.
He has heard me, now when the pieces begin to crumble .. will he try to back me into a corner (and will I have the resolve .. to fight back out of that corner). I hope to!
I'm planning on it.
Perfect comeback someone had here the other day .. when he does the whole "I don't have time for that chit" .. the response of, "No one does .. that's what I've been saying".
I like that.