I've posted before about in-law care-giving. Aged mother in law, lives in same town.
We are at the tail end of a visit from sister in law from several states away. Sister in law has been here for 3 weeks caring for her mother. A much welcome respite.
It had been discussed, prior to her arrival here on the scene, she would be talking it over with her mother, to try and get her mom to come up to her home, for a stay of maybe a few months.
This, in my opinion, is absolutely essential, as I am expecting twin grand-children, due in about 1 month (if they don't come sooner, as is the case a lot of times with multiples pregnancies). The expectant mother also lives locally here, and has a 4 year old daughter. I will be on that front, helping .. as much as is needed. And not on the front with mother in law and care-giving, and have made that as obvious and apparent as I know how to make it. It would be great if mother in law would agree to go to her daughter's home (several states away) for a period of a few months .. and allow me the latitude to put my energies where I want them to be, on my daughter who will have had a c-section .. and my grand-daughter (4 years old) and new twin babies.
Nothing doing. Mother in law has dug in her heels, and will not hear of it, going to stay with her daughter for any period of time.
What are her reasons?
In mother in law's defense ... her daughter ... I don't even know how to describe it. I will say that when her daughter comes here to visit, she all but breathes for her mother and if she could find a way to do that, she'd do that too. She is the most nervous nelly, never sit down - ever ... worry wart, do everything, all the time .. person that I've ever encountered.
A great example, as I was taking her to the airport yesterday for her departure, . I reached into the fridge to grab myself a bottled water and shut the fridge and turned to walk away, as I've done for all of my 50 plus years living on this earth .. and she said to me, "Oh make sure that fridge shut". WTH???? Like I don't know how to shut a fridge? That's just a small, very small slice of what she is ... how she is.
She is so very hyper-vigilant, seeing to every minute details down to it's finest most minuscule point, fine tooth comb, questioning every point along the way, "should we do thus and so, but maybe if we do thus and so, then such and such will happen, maybe we should do it thus and so .. but then so and so might happen, maybe we shouldn't do thus and so, but do "x" "y" and "z" instead, but if we don't do it that way then ..........", on and on and on and on it goes. And usually in hyper warp speed, as to every single friggin thing.
If her mother moans .. "what's wrong mother?, why did you moan, are you alright?".
Mother: "Yes, I'm fine, I was just sighing out loud".
Sister: "Why did you sigh? Are you hurting, are you sure you're alright, why are you sighing what's the matter?"
Mother: "For God's sake __________________, I was just sighing, .. calm down, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, .. because if something is wrong you need to tell me".
Mother: "Everything is fine, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, we did a lot yesterday, did we do too much, maybe we shouldn't of gone to two doctors in one day .. was that too much for you, are you too tired now, maybe we need to move those other doctor appointments so we won't have two in one day, is that too much for you, for one day .. is that why you were sighing .. what's wrong, are you sure you're alright".
Hopefully that kinda gives a little bit of a snapshot of what goes on when sister is in the ring directing things.
So in mother in law's defense.. I do get it, why she wouldn't be chomping at the bit to go to her daughter's home.
BUT ....
The only experience she has with her daughter, in the last years as mother in law has aged and been unable to go anywhere much, has been the daughter coming here, periodically, for periods of about 3 weeks at a stretch. When her daughter comes here, she moves heaven and earth for her mother and then some, and doesn't sit down, doesn't stop .. the WHOLE ENTIRE TIME.
Is there a possibility maybe (as I said to mother in law, when she expressed that isn't happening - talking to me - her going to her daughters .. ever) .. could it be possible that maybe if you would go to where she lives .. she'd be more busy managing her own life in that setting than your's and she would get out of your backside .. and not be as hyper-drive-vigilant as you experience in her, when she's here, could that be possible.
The daughter is retired, lives several states away. Does come here, generally, every few months .. and stays for a period of about 3 weeks at a stretch. I wish I could make a list of everything the daughter did when here this last time, but it would take up the whole character allotment:
I have pondered in recent years if all of her madness has a method. Maybe if she asks enough questions and opens up enough rabbit holes to fall into with all of her "maybe it's this, maybe it's that, maybe we should do xyz .. but maybe we need to do ABC first .. but did we call this doctor, have we talked to that doctor, ... why does she do this, why does mother do like this".
If she asks enough questions, opens up enough rabbit holes to go down .. it diverts .. just enough that she doesn't have to step up to the plate and begin figuring a better way in all of this, as the one who sits an armchair QB's it all.
My posts here .. on all this topic started about 1 month ago. With worry that I would be called upon at a time that I am unavailable and had said that would be the case.
In one month's time, we've had
xtreme concern and worry over the swollen/feet ankles/failure to take Lasix
Both toilets, not one, but both, at one time .. emergency ... all hands on deck
Broken AC .. which SIl then directed from afar to have neighbor install window unit
(resulting in DH having to go assist, then go because of problems with said window
unit)
And now yesterday's episode, all hands-on-deck ....something isn't right, medical
maldy which is now being attributed to, without medical eval, dehydration - so I
hear
Oh and somewhere in there, her inability to come to her son's 60th bday here, even though we'd go get her and bring her here and take her home.
Oh but this is the person who points her aged crooked finger with so much fervor and announces, "I know what I have to do here, and I will do it, I will manage". As an answer to the push on my part that she needs more help. And her two grown kids, continue to march to the beat of that drum in lockstep. Hopping to at every hiccup along the way.
Yes, according to DH last night, .. he spent the night there, haven't yet talked to him this morning. But last night's conversation, .. she isn't going to the hospital, she's fine. I'm sitting right here talking to her, .. she just answered the phone just fine, without any difficulties .. she just turned up the tv .. and changed the channel, she knows how to operate the remote, .. she's just fine... it must've been just dehydration.
Uhm okay.
I'm out.
First off, .. a medical evaluation and possibly even hospital stay to determine that as definite, would've been in order, but uhm .. okay. And secondly, been there/done that so many times with her. Cognitive impairment .. that hasn't been addressed and dealt with. The woman should know, but she is impaired and can't know it .. that she cannot continue to "manage" as she says she can ... she doesn't eat/hydrate properly, doesn't take her medication properly .. and she should know, someone with all cylinders firing .. what the result of said neglect is. But she will manage, she knows what she needs to do and she'll do it.
Yes, she will call upon (what used to be me) to get on the front line and wage these battles to right the course. Now it's DH. And SIL from afar with her armchair QB'ing.
I'm out. I'm over here and not getting in the muck and mire of it all.
Does it piss me off. OH SO MUCH YES.
As I told SIL last night, when she texted me, her words, "it just seems like it's getting harder and harder for mother to manage .. maybe even she is now realizing that, .. I guess I"m going to have to make my way there and pack her up and bring her here, tell her it's temporary .. but I think maybe it will have to be permanent. I just hope that I am up to the physical challenge of it all. I had hoped to be able to rest from this kidcare visit here .. and then come that way .. I came home from there, geriatric care, to the kids coming .. and so I've had them for 3 plus weeks .. and now it looks like I need to jump right back into the geriatric care".
There's so much I wanted to say to her, but I'm so so weary and so so tired of offering solutions that don't get "heard", so so so weary of saying over and over and over "she needs more help" only to hear in the end, "she's so stubborn, she won't *let us* do thus and so". Just over it.
I simply answered that text with, "my day is coming too, I have two aged parents that live local and they are divorced so that should be a lot of fun when that day comes".
She texted again, .. questioning something or other as to the whole day's events, and I deferred to her brother. "H is over there, I'm sure he can answer that, I'm going to bed, g'nite".
And that was that.
Does it help any that we ALL see that SIL is an idiot? I hope so.
Hubby quickly "got momma's number." Altho he cannot fully detach just yet.
SIL...whatever. Once a magpie, always a magpie.
And you...? OUTSIDE OF IT. Which is precisely where you need to be.
May not always feel right or comfortable, but KEEP YOURSELF ON THE OUTSIDE. Trust us, you earned this. And it's the right thing to do. 👍🏼
Or, if anyone calls or talks about MIL:
Have her drive herself to the E.R., or call 911 herself?
I read the 911 story-she is playing a dangerous game with emergency services-having to sign a waiver.
You could try to feel better about yourself, knowing that you did your part, albeit against your better judgment, you did step up.
Enjoy those precious moments with grands. Smile.
The 4 yo adores her little brother and sister, and is very helpful, to the extent of her abilities anyway. She has had some bratdom in it all, but that's to be expected I suppose. Things seem to be settling to a more normal for all of them.
They went to their own home on Thursday evening of this past week. DH and I were there on the scene that evening, to mind babies, help put things where they belong, just .. in general .. help them to set up .. and take up residency in their own home.
We left after they got some things settled.
Friday, I was back over there to sit with the little baby girl and the 4 yo, for a doctor appointment she took the little baby boy to do. Stayed there and washed dishes, did some laundry, tidied up for her .. washed bottles, etc. And then fixed them lunch and left, about what would be naptime for the 4 yo, and left their mommy with it.
Saturday and Sunday, I presume her husband was around to help, didn't ask, just stayed away.
Monday, stayed away, texted dd that if she needs me, just text me, and I'll do what I can to help. She responded she thought she'd be fine. By Tuesday .. yesterday .. she wanted me to take the 4 yo and go do something fun with her .. not have to have the 4 yo saddled with constant, "go get this for me, go throw this away .. go get that for me", .. so I took the 4 yo and we did fun 4 yo stuff for the day and she went home that night to her mommy and daddy.
Today we all went to my mom's for lunch .. dd and the kids and spent a while over there.
I'm trying to stay in the b'ground and only pop up when needed. I am worn to a nub though. This childcare thing .. it's rewarding and precious but it is awfully exhausting when you aren't a young one anymore.
Aargh! No! It was all going so well!
And then you had to run and get the Pedi-bloody-wotsit-called, and then daughter rallied round too, and the net net is that MIL succeeded in splashing herself over at least 3, and more like 4 counting your mother, people's days.
You do know the story of the boy who cried wolf, do you?
Of course, eventually the wolf did turn up. Which is why DH and SIL need to get their dearest mama safely tucked up in a wolf-proof ILF.
But 6/10, because you really did make a lot of progress today. Just need to work on the follow-through, where you don't rescue Husband *either* - because he needs to learn. And hugs, it truly will begin to make more sense and get much easier.
And how are the babies? :)
Be on his team. Don't try to get him to talk to SIL; fend her off with a stock answer ( see above).
Dorker, you are either a saint or completely crazy!! I thought MY mother was a pill!! Your MIL takes the cake and the prize.
WHY is she still living at home, alone?
WHY do you even ANSWER the phone when she calls?
WHY is SIL so involved? Why are you??
I am not being snarky--I am truly just aghast at all that I have read. Your WHOLE FAMILY is being manipulated by one angry, narcisssistic old woman.
I have no advice--just deep, deep sorrow for you. It's never going to get better, she's terribly ill, mentally and physically--and my best guess is, She LOVES it.
Can you just cuddle those babes and ignore her COMPLETELY?? I would. I have. Babies come waaaaay ahead of my 87 you old mother's wacky life problems.
Good luck--you need it.
You need a stock answer.
" We don't know enough right now. H will get back to you when he has answers".
Just keep saying that.
Did I mention she's an idiot?
I'm kinda ck'g out of it all, as far as H and his sister are aware anyway. For now. Anytime I find that I am ramping up in my own anxiety and anger, it's a big red flashing sign to me, "too involved, too involved, back up". And that was how rapidly that red flashing sign began in my brain. SIL and her 40 questions ... "I asked mother if she would agree to go see her primary care doctor".
WHO THE H*LL DO YOU THINK WILL GET HER THERE?!??!?!?!
Either H who is already taxed beyond all measure just with other issues alone .. and now this on his plate .. or more to the point, ME .. the "ME" that no one wants to listen to has has shouted for months and months that this situation needs more help.
No, but we're going to let MIL point her aged crook arthritic finger and so demonstratively declare .. "I know what I need to do here, and I will do it, I will manage", .. or the other ... "she's so stubborn .. she just won't *let us* do so and so, she's just so stubborn".
I have to back away .. I have to. I began to feel my blood boil at SIL's, "I asked her will you go to your primary care doctor". What the h*ll? What kinda idiot are you, you're smarter than this. Any primary care doctor is going to refer her to the ER .. for more evaluation .. and post haste ... so why are even entertaining the notion of a visit to the primary care doc when we all know good and well that's what the end result will be. No, let's let MIL continue to call the shots while we all sit around and play 40 questions about it all.
NOPE.
It's very interesting ...when SIL called, H had just walked in I had barely had 2 mins to talk to him, her unable to find him to talk to him. She called my cell. I saw it was her calling, picked it up and showed him, "your sister, wanna answer it?". No response from him .. a blank look of a deer caught in the headlights ... and I asked again, "I have a hard time dealing with her H you know that". He said, "Just answer it, and tell her that you are talking to me that you'll call me back". I didn't even get to say that to her, .. before the 40 questions began .. "Well I wonder .. ya know I was talking to her this morning first thing, but you know I've been so busy here with this company I haven't had time to have any in depth conversations with her at all ... and so this morning when I ck'd in with her, she seemed so vague, .. almost like she was avoiding talking to me". H could hear this, his sister was on speaker, he responded, "She was being vague because she wasn't firing on all cylinders and didn't want you to catch on to that". SIL answered that with: "you're probably right, I just thought she was being a bit odd ... and vague". SIL then goes into: "I wonder is it dehydration?, how would she have gotten dehydrated, what has she been doing .. you know she does this from time to time and she doesn't eat right and doesn't stay well hydrated .. I just don't know .. I wonder if that's what's going on, .. I wish she'd go to the hospital". That's when she said what she did about, "I asked her if she'd be willing to go to her primary care doctor". And I began to ramp up in my tone of voice .. to an octave below frustration and yelling, and asked her, in anger, "Why are we even entertaining that notion at all, .... a primary care doctor doesn't have an MRI or a CT Scan in his back pocket .. they are going to defer to the ER .. why are we even talking about that".
That's when H put up his hand in a tamper it down motion .. I wanted to scream at him and throw the phone at him at that moment, "That's why I ASKED YOU TO TALK TO HER".
I did dispense with that phone conversation pretty quickly after that. Once she was off the line, I told him, "I cannot deal with her 40 questions H .. I can't do it ... she isn't here .. she sits up there and armchair quaterbacks it all down here .. and when she comes here, she does everything but BREATHE for your mother and so doesn't get a real clear accurate picture of just how dimished your mother is .. and her capabilities .. and I've said it a 1000 times ... she needs more help .. but I'm sick of saying it, and I'm d*mn sure sick of answering 40 questions, you talk to her, I'm not going to".
And with that, he went and packed up a few things to go for the night to stay with his mom and the rest of the story is already above.
I just don't get it with these people. I just don't.
Dorker, you are saying the right things and have all along. H is not ready yet, it seems, to make the needed decisions. How will he feel if she has had a stroke and he has not done what he should have, so her health suffers more than it might have?
Look, a clear change in mental status (not knowing how to do a mechanical task previously done with ease qualifies as a change in mental status) needs to be looked into. When it's transitory, it's sometimes a TIA and most of the cognitive functioning comes back. But damage is done to the brain with each TIA and the damage is cumulative.
Just one more thing: the fact that she thought that they were going to take her to "that" place? It may mean that she wasn't understanding what was being said to her, the same way that she didn't understand at least parts of her conversation with you.
I'm sad that no one is listening to you, Dorker, you have MIL's best interests at heart. I'm glad that your husband is finally starting to see that he needs to at least pretend to be the adult in this equation.
I'm sorry for how frustrating this is for you. In case anyone asks you, arriving at an ER by private vehicle and complaining of a headache and vague cognitive symptoms is going to get them a VERY long wait in the ER. In my book, if you need to go to the ER, you need to go via ambulance. IF DH asks you, have him call 911 again and have them transport her.
He is out at his mom's right now, to spend the night, and try to persuade her to go to the hospital and he will take her. But as of the last I spoke with him, ... here is his assessment (which shouldn't be relied upon here, but oh well) his words: "She is NOT going to the hospital, she is fine she says .. I'm sitting here with her right now, while she eats and she and I are conversing just fine .. and she says she's better now".
I asked, "can she now answer a telephone, work a microwave, drive a car .. figure out an ignition to do so .. work the stove eyes, .. shower handles .. bathroom sink handles, .. do you know".
There's been no further answer to those questions.
I did tell him earlier, .. "she should've been made to go earlier when the EMT's were there".
SIL (made aware of this by DH earlier in the day as it was ongoing) .. SIL trying to say to me .. she couldn't reach DH in some of this, as the afternoon has waned on, and so called me. Trying to say to me, "yea she didn't want to go because they were going to take her to that place that's associated with that hospital where dad died several years ago, she doesn't like that hospital outfit .. doesn't want anything to do with that hospital organization .. ".
I answered that, "EMT's will take a person who isn't imminently dying .. to wherever they designate .. within reason ... she could've chosen the hospital of her preference".
SIL: "She said they told her they were taking her to that doc in the box place .. the one affiliated with the hospital she doesn't like".
I turned to H who was here finally at that moment, "DId you hear them tell her she HAS TO GO TO the doc in the box XYZ place, .. did you hear that conversation?". He said no, that no one said that to her.
SIL: "I asked her if she would go to her primary care doctor, would she be willing to do that".
At that, I raised my voice a bit in a bit of anger, to the point that H motioned to me to tamper it down some .. he could sense I was ramping up in anger; "SIL .. it's not up to her to decide to MAKE AN APPT with the primary care doctor, .. ifs he is having symptoms of this sort, the Primary care doc is going to refer her to the ER .. where she should've gone".
At that, H piped in, "I guess that screw up is on me isn't it?, I should've insisted she go".
I acknowledged his question with a resounding "YES .. you needed her to go .. and letting her decide is not the thing to do".
He had already decided at that point he was going to spend the night there, and trying to persuade her to let him take her to the hospital of her choice ..
But as you see above, he is there, and he seems to be thinking a hospital visit isn't in order.
I asked him if she's okay to drive .. she sure wasn't earlier .. and is she okay to operate a shower .. and it's handles, a bathroom faucet .. and it's handles, a microwave .. a stove eye ...
No answer thus far ...
WHERE IS MY HELMET ... I know where it is, it's busted from having banged my head too many times.
She is self-neglecting, not understanding ow to stay hydrated.
I believe she's already showing significant cognitive decline; the reason she's not making the Lean Cuisine meals is that she can't figure out the microwave, count on it.
Ball is in DH's court. I think I already told you the story of my mom, who had a similar episode, blindingly bad headache, couldn't figure out the phone. My SIL called 911 and no one asked mom's "opinion " about whether she was going to the hospital. My brother simply directed the EMTs to transport her.
Sometimes you have to be the adult in the room.
I did, .. trying to stay at arm's length from it all .. but yet feeling bad for DH, I ran to Walgreens while he was at a jobsite having left his mother's. Got her the dreaded Pedialyte packets. Had those here for DH when he gets here ... but youngest daughter heard all that was ongoing and offered to run them out there to MIL for her dad.
She tried to call MIL, at my request, as MIL didn't know anyone was coming imminently, .. and got no answer when she tried to call her. DH had already said he'd tried to call her earlier, about 30 mins prior and got no answer either. Not unusual for her. She does have call waiting as a feature on her phone but has never learned to use it. If you call her, and she's on the other line, it just rings into infinity. She won't switch over. So the assumption was that she was on the other line and not switching over.
Youngest daughter left with the packets of Pedialyte and said she'd keep trying to reach her.
Youngest daughter left, .. and as soon as she was gone, the phone rang here, and it was MIL. MIL said: "Did H just try to call me?". I said, "No, youngest daughter did, she's on her way out to you, has some of those Pedialyte packets ..."
MIL said: "Did H try to call?". I repeated what I just said. She said, "Oh well I knew the phone was ringing but I couldn't ... this is just the darndest thing, I don't know what's going on with me here .. I couldn't get the phone".
I said, "couldn't get it because you were on the other line?". "No, I haven't talked to anyone .. I can't figure .. I can't do the phone". I said, "you're talking to me on your phone, how did you call me". She said, "Did I call you?". I said, "yes, you did, you called me". She then said again: "was it H that tried to call me?".
SIGH
I repeated again, now worried ... what I'd said now 2 x's already, that no .. youngest daughter tried to call her, and is on her way to bring her some Pedialyte.
She said, "well I know that H called earlier, did he call me earlier?". I said, "yes he did, maybe 30 minutes ago, but he couldn't get you, we figured you were on the phone with someone". She said, "No, I haven't been on the phone, I just can't get to the phone, I can't work the phone".
I said, "you can't work the phone?". She said, "No, I really can't, I don't know what's wrong here, I can't work the phone". I said, "well you just called me, how did you do that?". She said again, "I called you?". Again I said, yes you called me. She said, "well I heard the phone ringing, but I couldn't get it". I asked, "Couldn't get it because you were in the bathroom or away from the phone?". She said, "No .. I could see it, it's right here, and I could see it, I could hear it was ringing, but I couldn't figure out how to make it work". I said, "MIL!!!!!! That sounds terrible, what do you mean you can't make it work, is it broken?". She said, "No, .. I don't know, .. I just .. I couldn't figure out how to answer it, . how to make it stop ringing".
This went on and on, until finally I said to her, "hang up the phone and I'm going to call you, and I want you to pick it up and press the button that says *talk* .. and that will then answer it, hang up now".
I'm now very concerned, and going to go beeline to DH about all this news, but hear him coming in .. I try to call her back and the line busy .. try again, it's busy ... over and over this goes on. I figure *oh no, now she didn't even know how to hang it up .. so I can't call her". I keep trying .. and finally it rings through .. and it rings and rings and rings and rings .. I'm thinking *yep something dreadful is wrong with her brain .. she can't answer it*, but then she does. Finally!
She said she had picked it up .. (don't know why it was busy and didn't go through the first several times) but that it did ring, but she had to study it .. and look and examine each button, couldn't figure out how to answer it.
By now H is in, and made aware of this latest concern .. as I'm talking to her. I ask her, "do you know what month it is". She said "let me think now, hold on, let me think" .. and she eventually answered "this is July isn't it?". I said, "yes it is". "Do you know what day this is?". "let me think, now wait a minute, let me think, .. today is Wednesday isn't it?". I said, "yes it is". I asked her, "I hear your TV going, did you turn that on .. do you remember how you did that, did you do that?". She said, "I did .. but I don't know how I did it .. I don't know how to turn it off really".
H is sitting .. listening to, and aware of what all is being talked about. I gave him the phone to talk to his mother, him now urging that he is coming to take her to the hospital . that he shouldn't of let the EMT's leave earlier without taking her .. and her assuring, "No I'm better now, I'm doing better now, I have the phone figured out I think now, It just took a while". He said, he was going out there to spend the night .. and would try to see if he can't get her to go to the hospital.
I didn't know it, but apparently (this person needs to be driving like a hole in the head and H is aware of that .. keenly aware) .. earlier when she'd gone out to get things for her dog, .. she talked about having gotten back in the car, and couldn't figure out how to start the car, keys/ignition .. that whole thing. Had to really study and think hard to remember how to do that, twice .. and for quite a bit of time .. before it finally came to her to put the keys in the ignition and turn it ..
Something has happened to her neurologically .. (or it could be a UTI for all I know), but no one will know a d*mn thing until medical professionals do some assessment, and if she won't go ...
A few more distress calls from his mother sprinkled with 911 calls and visits where she refuses to go for evaluation will force your husband to speak with his sister about getting THEIR mother into supervised living. The MIL won't even feed herself. She isn't able to provide herself with that basic need.
Busy men with a business to run don't cotton to this well. Their tolerance is much lower.
Truth is this is a good thing for both siblings to help them conclude that their mother's safety is at risk and make the decision to do something about it.
Stay the course, Dorker.
DH is getting the flavor of what youve been dealing with. He will put a smart end to this in short order, I believe.
Despair not!
And hats off to your daughter.
H was out to see his mom this past Sunday for a few hours, nothing more than just a visit. It's been astounding how well she has managed, or if she isn't managing, it hasn't been evident.
I assumed, no news, is good news.
Well, until .. this afternoon.
I was at my mother's house, having lunch with her, and dd and the new babies and the 4 yo, for my mom to visit with the new babies and dd.
My mother has some ongoing home repair problems that H is working on for her, in between when he has a spare minute or two (which is few and far between with him). He happened to call while we were there having lunch, told my mother he was on his way there to continue some work on her problems at her house.
He never showed up.
He did call in a little bit and explain that he'd been on the road, the very road my mother lives on, when his mother called, and said something isn't right, .. something is wrong with her. H said he had to turn around and head in the direction towards his mother ... (his mother lives a good 30 minutes or more from where H would've been at that moment). I asked H what his mother describes as "something isn't right". He said that his mother called and said she can't think, . .she has a headache and she can't think .. that she'd gone to get the dog's food (specialty food she orders via a vet .. can't be found online, I've looked BELIEVE ME). And that she'd gotten somewhat disoriented and forgot where she was, and why momentarily .. this after having struggled all morning with what was a splitting headache that wouldn't subside, and some confusion and just "not right" all morning .. and that she just can't think.
I asked him if he has called 911? No, he said ... not sure if he needs to assess the situation before doing so. Sitting there listening to this ongoing conversation is my mother, and dd. Both of them, "tell him to call 911 .. she could be having a stroke, she needs medical professionals to look at the situation, not him". Told him that, .. he responded, "I don't know, . not sure if she wants me to do that". I responded, "doesn't matter what she wants, what does she *need* is the more important issue, and you aren't a medical professional".
At that, he said, "let me go, I'm trying to get out there to where she lives".
I hung up. Both my mother and dd looking at me in astonished kinda amazement that no one in this whole scenario might think it a necessity to do that.
Dd picks up her phone and calls her husband .. (her husband works for my husband and so, would've been with H at that moment). "you need to tell dad that he has to call 911 .. they need to get there now .. if she's having a stroke, it might be that some medical intervention can stave off worse damage".
I couldn't hear what was said to her by her husband. But she soon hung up and said 911 has been called. Neither of us, not myself, nor dd rushed right out. We were visiting with my mom at that moment, a good 30 mins plus to get to where MIL lives from that vicinity .. and of course, H already in route, and obviously now .. 911 having been summoned. No need that I drop and run at this point, or dd, for that matter.
H called me back and asked what the code is for the lockbox on her front porch so rescue personnel can access the front door key .. that he hopes they don't just kick her door in .. (she has a garage code which is different, punch in a 4 digit code to enter via the garage.. have the garage door then rise for you, if you know that 4 digit code), but she keeps that on lockdown, unless she knows you are coming .. and even then sometimes doesn't disarm it). She has a lockbox mounted on her front porch and that is a 4 digit code also, but a different code .. and H didn't remember, right off the top of his head, that 4 digit code. Asked me what it is .. I asked him before answering, "have you had her use her life alert button . she should! .. that info is all available to the personnel who manage that system for her, and they will alert rescue personnel".
He said no, that he'd asked her to do so, and no .. she didn't want to do that, she just needed him to come, "something isn't right".
I gave him the *different* 4 digit code to access that lockbox to gain the key to the front door. At that, he and I ceased out conversation and I went on with my visit with my mother and dd, and the babies, etc.
I left after a while, had a doctor appointment for me, to get to.
Called H on the way "how is your mom, are you there, what's going on?".
He said this: "Rescue personnel have left ... she seems lucid, seems fine .... she can answer any questions they have for her ... she thinks maybe she was just dehydrated .... not sure, but Rescue personnel have been sent away and she signed a waiver for them that she didn't need transport, her vitals were all fine .. she sitting right here, she can make conversation".
I said, "what about this *I can't think, I'm disoriented* .. what about that". He said, "she thinks maybe she is just dehydrated".
SIGH. Been there/done that, have the holey t-shirt to prove it, so so many times.
I hung up from him to go ahead and get to my doc appt.
Talked to him a bit later, "so are you still at your mom's?".
He said with some disgust to his tone: "No, I've left there .. I had to get back to the jobsite that I abandoned this morning .. a nightmare from h*ll ... can't seem to get finished there and had to be somewhere else at that time, so I abandoned it til later ... and so I'm heading back to that now .. driving .. I've left mom's ... she thinks maybe she was just dehydrated .. she's not sure ... she's out of Pedialyte, so I have to go BACK out there after I finish work here in a while, and take her some Pedialyte .. I got her a bottled water, she has a fridge full of them.... and made her a sandwich .. I fussed at her, her freezer is FULL of those frozen dinners, that just sit there .. day after day after day .. I fussed at her, "mother these aren't gonna hop out of the freezer and cook themselves ... we've been here done that/you have to eat .. and eat something nutritious you can't live on crackers and fruit ... and you have to drink .. you can't .. when's the last time you ate something".
She said last night, she had crackers and a handful of grapes. He asked her when was the last time she drank anything, .. she said this morning, she drank coffee, .. thinking the caffeine would help with the splitting headache .. but that's it. I told him, "FWIW .. caffeine is a diuretic .. that's not a means of hydration by any standard".
He said he fixed her a sandwich and sat with her, with her a bottle of water and he fussed at her some, about all the boxes and boxes and boxes of unopened freezer dinners .. (Meals on Wheels .. is supposedly working her through a wait list ...???..... don't know...???....). That's a whole other story.
We'd been forever dealing with her and this lack of nutrition thing (her a freezer full of Lean Cuisines and so forth) .. and never use them, sustaining on a cracker and a handful of grapes. And so we had, through the local area on aging . found a service here locally ... fresh hot meals delivered .. daily, .. whatever you choose.
Signed up for that service, .. (but she didn't like their ground meat, whatever they were choosing, and so could we talk to them about modifying her options on the days they serve ground meats of any sort, i.e. spaghetti, meatloaf, hamburger patty, etc etc). Did that. She didn't like that they don't always come at the same time daily (they can't, they deliver to multiple people who are elderly and all with differing mobility issues and retrieval of said meals .. and traffic and any other concerns that may delay the time they arrive). Many many quirks to work out. Finally got that just about ironed out, when the only local company that does that kinda thing .. sent notice they were vacating this area of the state. Moving to a different part of the state.
It was the only way that she even began to eat nutritiously ... those meals that were delivered 3 x's weekly. MIL always vehemently opposed to MOW. Her mindset was that she used to, as a community svc project thru her church, go and help prepare those meals and she saw what goes in them, and was NOT impressed. Didn't want any part of it.
We had been able to skirt around the above, via that local company, but they were now leaving town.
I urged SIL, who was here at the time, to contact the area council on aging and see about getting MOW involved. There was some backing and forthing over all that, that MIL doesn't like them, we'll just go with the frozen meals. My argument to that (get so tired of arguing my point when it's not my mother, not my concern), my argument to that: "We've been there and done that, those frozen meals sit in her freezer unused". SIL: "I don't get what the difference is, this company brings these meals and they are fresh yes, but the are chilled, she has to stick them in the microwave, what's the difference, heat up a frozen meal in the microwave or one of these fresh ones .. but she just won't do it, with the microwave ones".
Back and forthing over it all. Finally SIL did meet with the area agency on aging and they supposedly put MIL on a waitlist for said meal delivery. I did ask SIL, .. "how'd you talk her into it, she's always been so opposed". SIL responded, "I don't know, she hasn't argued with me".
So SIL left here about a month ago, .. and that was one of the millions of other things SIL did while here, meet with that aging council social worker .. to see what services her mother qualifies for, and get her mother on the wait list for MOW.
Whether MIL's name has come up and MIL waved them off .. not interested, I don't know. Whether MIL is still considered as a waitlist person, I don't know.
But nonetheless, H mentioning that he fussed at his mom, freezer full of microwave meals sit uneaten, day after day after day.
He said he told her THIS is the reason some people have to go into assisted living mother, there are staff members there to keep a watchful eye on things like this.
I asked him what her response was, and he said it was the same as always "I know, I know .. I look at them, but I just don't want them .. it's just easier to eat a handful of grapes".
I said to H, with a big sigh "Been there/done that, far too often".
He seems disgusted with her. And more than anything else, pushed.
That's why I would have even ever been engaged in it all. He is trying to run a business, which is our livelihood . and now finding that he has to go BACK OUT THERE to take her some Pedialyte later .. that she can drink to stay better hydrated. She has bottled water .. by the case .. in her fridge .. but she prefers to mix those flavor packets into a bottle of water .. it's more appealing.
She's been going to the grocery on her own (absent youngest daughter who went for her last week). Why the Pedialyte, which is a staple she keeps on hand, didn't make it onto a list anywhere is beyond me.
Sounds like H got a bit put out with his mother in that he had her a sandwich fixed, which she dutifully sat there and did polish off most of it .. and some chopped up fruit and a bottle of water, and she then began waxing and waning on about her years growing up in so and so .. and such and such person and this and that .. (he is BUSY .. he doesn't have time for all this, and he feels the push of what all he needs to be doing, yet he is sitting listening to this ....., he needs to get back to what is on his radar to get done). And that she began to wax and wane on and on about her growing up years .. and that she said to him that she feels better now, that she just needed someone to come talk to her .. and ck her out, and that she feels better now that someone has come and talked to her and made sure she's okay.
So H .. angry and stressed that he has to GO BACK OUT THERE AGAIN with Pedialyte in hand for her. H has to get BACK to that nightmare job he had to abandon earlier, and then he is signed up at the church to work vacation bible school nightly and so is to be there at 6 .. and hasn't been able to go any night this week yet, because of work interfering and so he feels the push of a responsibility there at church .. that he signed on to see through and hasn't been able to see it through .. yet he needs to get back to his mother with some Pedialyte for her.
These are the things that would "pull me in" through the years. .. H already spoken for, be that work, or some other commitment via church or whatever .. and his mother in "need". Yet I would get disgusted .. this very same scenario above has happened far too often.
Thus the reason that I have said so frequently .. that she needs more help.....and no one listens to what I have to say .. banging my head repeatedly, thus the reason for this whole thread.
Feel bad for H .. but engaging .. doesn't solve it either .....
What I extrapolate from the situation is that obviously SIL needs more to do with her time than to conjure up "need" for MIL. MIL, at present, .. and I suppose, .. at other times when SIL has been ck'd out, has either fared okay or hasn't .. but SIL has obviously chosen at those times to not wring her hands and obsess over what the perceived need is ... being she is otherwise occupied.
FWIW, I have urged that a professional assessment be done by our local council on aging, and as such, maybe there are some services available through the local community organizations (i.e., medical transport for doc appointments .. which I do know is available to those who need it). Thus far, no one has seen fit to have such assessment done.
I haven't asked H if he's been in contact with his mom, not for a few days. I suppose if there were some perceived need being hurled in his direction, he'd mention it.
I don't know, I mean .. typically I'd be told by SIL, .. "Gee mom could sure use someone to get her to the library, there are a few books she wants to check out, and she has called them, they have the library book set aside for her, she just can't get there".
That would be one need hurled out, occasionally. I have been on that train before, .. and offered to go pick them up and ck them out with my library card. No, no . of course not .. no, she wants to mill about, at her slow slow pace. I don't have time for that, and have said so.
Is H not being bugged to "gee mom needs someone to get her to the library?". I guess not. That wouldn't be his forte. The last time he went there, he had no idea they'd done away with the thing called a "card catalog". No he isn't into digital technology.
I guess if that were being passed his way, the whole "need" and the library, I'd hear about it.
I might would be getting summoned to "mom has so and so doc appt on _______________, do you think you could drive her to that".
I suppose if their mom has a doc appt on __________________, she is either getting there on her own, or not going at all, and cancelling it. I haven't heard H mention that he is being summoned to do so.
I might would get summoned "Mom needs to get to the pet store, she needs to see about getting _________________, or maybe you could pick it up for her, and get it to her".
I put a stop to most of that, by insisting on Amazon.com, for pet needs, where applicable. But that doesn't mean a meandering/wandering through the pet store isn't still coveted.
Is H being summoned for same. I haven't heard if he has been.
The point is .. SIL is so covered up right now with her own family visiting ... and true to form with her .. when she was in Europe with her husband and family vacationing, or when she went to where her son lives for 3 weeks ... the perceived "need", the never ending "need", it ceases somehow.
Why is that?
Is it because SIL obviously needs to find some d*mn something else to do with her time, . because obviously when she DOES HAVE something else to do with her time, the "perceived need" .. it doesn't get mentioned. Or if there is need ... SIL obviously content to let her mother do on her own, absent her ability to jump in and micromanage from afar.
Who knows.
And I like that option .. when H mentions, "Sister says that I need to do thus and so for mom", that's good. An answer of, "oh really", .. and move on, no questioning, . no arguing, just move on. Force him to put it on my plate and then and only then speak up that I don't have time.
I suspect that all and sundry would get a better view of MIL'S actually needs if a professional needs assessment was done by AAA and reported to family.
Out of pocket meaning off the radar is a new one on me, too. Though I expect SIL was also quite a lot poorer, all those trips to Europe and what have you?
To go back a bit. Dorker, on the issue of how to handle SIL's alarms to DH, and how you were thinking what to say to him. Don't say anything. Zip it. And when he brings it up, and says why am I suddenly getting all these calls etc., go vague and innocent. "Gosh, are you? Well, well." And when he says SIL says MIL needs blah blah blah, you say "does she? Well, there it is." Make sure the ball stays in his court. Do not pick it up. Not your mother. Not your problem. As far as possible, within normal marital and humanitarian bounds, not even your business.
This will force him, if he wants you to do something for his mother, to spell out that he wants you to do it and to be specific. "I haven't got time to pick up her px - can you?"
And you say "I haven't time, either. No."
And when things come to a head and he blows up about how he can't be dealing with all this, that is when you gently remind him that he needs to find better options because it is only going to get worse; and that you will not facilitate a living situation that is increasingly dangerous for your MIL and onerous for both him and yourself.
I think you mean that SIL is not checked in, out of the loop, not passing on her own ocd perceived need of MIL'S need. Good to get some clarity on that.
Perhaps MIL actually DOES know what she needs to do!
She went to where her son lives, .. a few years ago .. for a 3 week visit. Out of pocket entirely. Same thing happens when son and his family visit here, which only occurs about once a year. She went to Europe for a 3 week vacation a couple of years ago, .. same thing. Out of pocket. Phone doesn't blow up with incessant demand.
I'm quite sure she is ck'g in with her mom, .. maybe even more than once a day. But what of all the "perceived" need. I have no clue. I guess because SIL is otherwise occupied, nothing is earth shattering ...???.... as to SIL's perception of what we need to do as to hoops to jump through. Not sure.