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Buzzy, "spaghetti junction.." that's a new one on me! I'll try to think of a slippery crossroads as a spaghetti junction, but right now it's just making me hungry for spaghetti.
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GardenArtist
So sorry. I forget not all know our British traffic systems. lol (or lack of them) hehehe
Copy, paste and go,  directly into the address bar - below for a good example.


i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/05/24/article-2149198-13436BEF000005DC-581_964x637.jpg
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Buzzy, thanks for the clarification. Michigan has been converting to "roundabout" which I think could also be accurately dubbed spaghetti junctions, or perhaps more accurately, "accidents waiting to happen." They're a mess.
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UPDATE! The insanity with this man never ceases. I called the case worker and requested that we exchange emails--that we could discuss whatever he needed to with me that way. He said "Never mind the message I left" and hung up on me. Okay, fine. I was not going to do this in a phone conversation. My next step was a certified letter, after I found out what he wanted, but it never got that far. Fine with me.

A good neighbor has now notified me that he was brought back to the house where he's being evicted. I don't know who brought him back. He only has one week left there before the eviction. The neighbor said he was "brought back to die." Does this sound right to anyone? What does that mean? Why wouldn't social services be handling this now? Could he have refused any help? "Brought back to die." sounds like something my father would say, not the hospital, but I have no idea.

On top of everything else, the another neighbor (bad neighbor) who does his shopping has cleaned out his checking account of every dime. Nearly $100,000, because he gave him his ATM card, which I told him not to do ages ago. This guy has been been shopping for him using his card, because he was stupid enough to turn it over, for convenience, I'm sure. He's probably been gradually taking whatever he wants off the top anyway, but now he's wiped it clean because this guy "thought he was going to die." So he helped himself. This person has committed a crime. Shouldn't something be done? My father is not going to do anything (neither call the police or press charges), since he thinks he came home to die, so he doesn't care. But this guy shouldn't be able to get away with this.

I'm so sick of this crap.
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Wrecked, call Adult Protective Services and report your father as an vulnerable, about to be homeless elder who is being financially abused.

Ask good neighbor to make a call as well.

I have NO idea why the hospital made such a boneheaded discharge. It's possible that your father " played" them and made claims that they bought. The hospital may have set up home care. No idea except this one:

This NOT your piles of $**t to clean up. Call APS, anonymously if you need to.
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Would you inherit much if that 100k were recovered? Unlikely since it would be used to pay for the cleanup and move of biodad to a new home. Can you get blood from a turnip? No, and you likely can't get a dollar out of the fraudster who took advantage if your crummy bio dad. Let them like in the bed they made themselves. If you want to call APS, do it anonymously, but just stay out of that man's issues. He's getting what he's sown.
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Thanks for the advice, Barb. You're a godsend right now! He played them, I just know it. That's what he's best at. He's been a pathological liar his entire life. This is his doing. This is how he operates.

No doubt he's been cussing & yelling, raising as much hell as possible, and making all kinds of threats. They probably hate him. It's what he does when others don't comply with what he demands and what he was demanding was to go "home" even though he doesn't have one.

Shouldn't a case worker know better than to be played? After talking to the guy, he's definitely a bonehead---the rudest a*****e (can I use that word?) I've ever spoken to (other than dearest dad). On top of that, I could barely follow what he was saying because he talks high speed and rattles off a bunch of jargon And to think he's supposed to be helping people!

I came here to reply to some of the last few posts from the other day I had not yet responded to, but thought I'd check my email first. That is when I found out about the robbery in an email from the neighbor, so I just found out right before posting here. I'll get back to the other replies later. This takes precedence at the moment.

If anyone else has any input, I'd be happy to hear it.
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Surprise, I don't want to do anything, and I sure don't want to get involved (anonymous, for sure), but that neighbor shouldn't get away with this. My dad is already rotting away. I'm way past done with his issues. This was so predictable too. I was just waiting for this news, and I mean literally.

As for inheritance, there is a savings account, so that one will get gouged badly if this one is gone. The way I see the inheritance, as I told him many times when I could get a word in edgewise, is that it was his money for his care. He screamed that there wasn't going to be any care and that I was going to have that money, yet there is no Will because he didn't want to bothered, even though he had decades to do it.

The way I see it, this is not about money, even though it would be a lifesaver. But my mom is always bending my ear that the money would be the least he could do after what he's put me through. She'll tell me to pursue this. I don't know.
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Did you get the name of the caseworker at the hospital?

I might call the hospital discharge department and find out if this man is actually an employee. I smell another of dad's plays here.
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Barb, I did get a name. Good point, I will check into this. Can you elaborate on what you think could be going on?
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Well, I've gotten phone calls in Chinese from NYC phone numbers that were not where the call originated. I've gotten calls from "The IRS has posted a warrant for your arrest" from a number that actually was listed as the IRS.

It seems possible that your dad got a "friend" to call you. I can't imagine a Hospital Case worker hanging up on someone or talking to you the way he did.

I think you might want to call hospital discharge to make a complaint about the case worker and the fact that your dad was "sent home to die". You may discover this was a scam of some sort on dad's part.

Look, you can do this because you have NO obligation to your father.
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Barb, I can't imagine it either, but this time it's not some ploy by my father. He doesn't have anyone left in his world to do something like that. He's been holed up in that house for eons. The good and bad neighbors are the only humans he's had any contact with for years. That I know because the good neighbor is sort of the watchdog around there.

If anything, it could be some other kind of scammer who found an open door via this whole mess. That doesn't quite make sense but nothing would surprise me anymore. The phone number does originate from the city the hospital is in. I will call the hospital today and find out if this case worker does in fact work there.
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I've confirmed that the phone number and case manager I called does work at the hospital, so that was legitimate.

I don't think they're going to tell me anything about his discharge because they've refused to tell me anything other than the case manager question, but I can try later. It's still too early here.
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Who's life is it? You have the choice to do what you want. Sure he is the sperm doner but that is not a reason for you to feel obligated. Just choose you and feel the guilt and move through it. You have already done a lot. What choice do you want to make? Write a ficticious letter to the sperm bank returning your caregiver gene and you will feel better and be able to go on with your life.
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Thanks Ellie. Fortunately, I do not feel obligated! I don't feel any guilt either. Zero. I came here to set everyone straight on that notion, but then another matter came up instead. But I still think it's cathartic to chat here and be able to vent. And I'm going to need to stick around because my mother is elderly now too and I may have questions once in a while.

When a new person posts on a site like this, they don't know what to expect from the members. I've seen a lot of accusations across the internet on elder care, and they're almost always in favor of the abuser/parent. They tell adult offspring that regardless of the horrible circumstances, they are wrong and selfish for not doing everything they can for such a parent. The irony in that! This has happened to me in 'real life' too, on this very issue.

So, sometimes it's best to say things in a way that sounds very compassionate and caring along with the hard truth, otherwise there are people who will attack you for being cold and uncaring. The problem with that is that then everyone thinks you're a bit too soft or a doormat and I'm afraid that might be what has happened here.

Anything I've said to make people think I feel a sense of responsibility, guilt, or obligation can move on from that now. I don't, and after being here and realizing that people would not attack me for being unwilling to be involved with this sperm donor, I know that I can speak freely now. Thank you to everyone for that! :)

So, just to clarify, I will never have any contact with this man again, not on the phone, not in letters, not on his death bed, not anything. I'm way beyond done. I haven't even spoken to him since 2016.
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I don't know what sites u were on that says no matter what, you have to take care of a parent. If you owe anyone, its the ones who love you and have been there for you. My daughter's Dad gave up his rights when she was adopted by my now husband at 8 yrs old. He never had much time for her before that. Yes he paid support, court ordered and deducted from his pay. I gave him schedules of ball games and school activities he chose not to come. TG he never asked anything of her when his health started to deteriorate. He died all alone. She felt bad for the way his life went but he chose to live that way. He was never a father to her and she felt she didn't owe him. She claims my husband is her father. Glad you feel as you do. We should never allow ourselves to be abused.
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Thank you so much, JoAnn. I really appreciate your understanding. You definitely get it.
It was not any specific sites where I saw those comments about caring for a parent no matter what. It was just various discussions across the internet where I would see people being very accusatory toward others in similar shoes as mine. There just seemed to be a lot of it and it was shocking. And then I experienced that in my own life. A friend of mine actually stopped speaking to me because I voiced what was happening and what I needed to do about it. She has loving parents, so she didn't get it and decided I was a bad person.

I'm so glad your daughter has your husband and is treated well by him. That is a wonderful thing for her. It sounds like her bio dad was similar to mine in terms of the lack of interest in her, but on top of that mine was horribly abusive. I was and still am fortunate to have a wonderful uncle on my mom's side who I adore.

NEW DEVELOPMENT: I'm now being contacted by a detective--I'm assuming about the stolen money, but I'm not sure. I hope he's not going to accuse me of being neglectful. That couldn't happen, could it? Am I going to be in trouble? I just don't know what to expect anymore. The good neighbor notified a police officer who just happens to live in the neighborhood and they went over to try to get some info from my father about the stolen money, but he was in such bad shape he couldn't speak (not drinking or eating), so he got hauled off in an ambulance again.

Does anyone have any advice about speaking with this detective? Anything I should be concerned about? Thanks!
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Wrecked, don't worry. You're not legally responsible for him. You're not his POA, caregiver or guardian. Plus you haven't talked to him in two years.
The hospital either discharged him or let him leave AMA. If they thought he was incompetent, they wouldn't have let him go.

Call the detective back, because fear of the unknown will drive you nuts. It's usually never as bad as we imagine.

Everything will be ok. You did nothing wrong.
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Thank you, Pepsee!!!!
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Yes, call the detective.
The only thing to fear in this situation is that someone you don't know is going to 1. think badly of you and/or 2. try to make you feel guilty.

I think you're pretty immune to both of those. If the detective can recoup some of that money for the old guy's care, and to bury him, that would be a bonus, yes?
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Wrecked, I have worried I've been too adamant about leaving your bio dad to lie in the bed he's made. I'm glad you were looking for that kind of support.

I understand about the potential for inheiritance. I chose to walk away from it the first time I went no contact with mthr. It's way big. When APS called me to rescue her, I did want to put her somewhere safe nainly to protect the people around her so she would not wander into the path of a car and traumatize that driver for life. However, my inheritance did factor into the decision.

Memory care + extras cost us over $50k a year and nursing homes are twice that and more. Evaluate what you would actually earn from your relationship before you become heavily emotionally invested. I chose to let the land fraud go because it was such a minor asset and it would be a pain to sell. The "loan" to the bank officer was repaid immediately and we let the officer retire without filing charges. It was not worth my time to pursue these folks. If my reparations were not so large, I likely would have allowed the state to take over and I'd still inherit the balance upon death, the tactic I think you could take.

One if the most useful things to express is, "it's so hard dealing with untreated mental illness." That gets sympathy on your side. "I'd love to be helpful, but he's pushed everyone helpful out of his life with verbal abuse." "He's wounded me with his words so many times I have protect myself." Best wishes with the detective.
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He may just have questions. You explain that your Dad has never been in your life. He contacted you but you have never and will not take responsibility for him. Be honest if asked about the money, you know nothing because you don't have any contact with him.
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Looked back, seem I missed the 100,000K that was stolen. Can't see where you would be considered involved. There is a witness and if using it with an ATM than there is video. I blame the bank. Only so much can be taken out a day. It should have sent up a red flag that his withdrawals were out of the norm.
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Surprise, thanks so much for the info and your thoughts on the matter. Please don't worry about being too adamant. I've found all of your posts extremely helpful. I can't put the potential for inheritance over my peace of mind, so I just cannot get that invested. He had a good career, but managed his money poorly and there really isn't a large sum to inherit anyway. I'm expecting nothing to be left. I just want the thief to go to jail for this. I don't want anyone getting away with something like this.

JoAnn, I wasn't actually worried about anyone thinking I was involved with the stolen money (that can be traced), but was thinking that maybe since I wasn't taking responsibility for him, they might accuse me of parental neglect, not knowing the history. Regarding the robbery, I blame the bank too. Thanks for the tips!

UPDATE - I have more info now. It was not the ATM card. That didn't really make sense. What happened is that my dad wrote his shopper/errand guy a blank check to go and purchase cremation services for him. Why was this necessary? Let the estate handle it! Instead, the guy just made the check out to himself for the amount in the account and cleaning it out. Who gives a blank check to someone they already don't trust?!! It's pure insanity! Not to mention, I'm sure he was ripping him off bit by bit the entire time with the card.

I've spoken with the detective. He seemed less concerned with the stolen money (he said that's just hearsay at the moment) than with collecting info on bio-dad. He said a conservator will be set up and he needed a lot of info. I didn't even have all the answers and felt a bit uncomfortable with some of the questions, but was not accused of neglect.

He wasn't interested when I mentioned abuse or abandonment of the relationship on my dad's part and was just on a mission to collect as much financial info and other details as possible. He didn't ask anything about me in that regard. I told him which medical insurance he has and that sort of thing. He asked about his retirement, how much it was, etc...I didn't have those answers. He asked if my name was on any of the bank accounts (it's not).

He asked the location of various bank accounts and approximate amounts. I was only able to tell him what I recalled bio-dad told me about that. He did say he was going to try to get info from the bank about this "supposed" large transaction. I hope they release that! He asked questions about why my dad had a smaller account at another bank. Isn't that a strange question? How would I know and what difference does it make? I told him about the shopping arrangements with the two neighbors and that the good one had to quit because bio-dad was verbally abusive. He then asked, "Abusive in what way?" I told him to talk to the neighbor, but that there was a lot of criticism, cussing fits, and unreasonable demands.

So, I guess he will be a ward of the state now, which is exactly what he never wanted. I'll update again once I find out about the stolen money.
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Wrecked, you did verify that this detective was with a police force, right?

Who notified him of the financial theft, and was there anyone who filed a complaint?
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GardenArtist, no, I didn't. Gosh, this is worrisome....everything needs to be verified! I'm learning a lot here. Thanks! He certainly sounded like a detective. He spoke in the typical way of a law enforcement officer, but I know that's no guarantee.

I assumed it was reported by another police officer who lives in the neighborhood. The good neighbor told him what happened, so they both went to bio-dad's house to find out what was going on. That is when an ambulance was again called.

APS was in the neighborhood today and went to the good neighbor's house to ask questions. It was APS for sure. She left her business card. Seemed like maybe they were doing an investigation, which would have occurred due to this being reported. It might have been the landlady who initially reported it, because she was at the house right after he was taken away in an ambulance (the 2nd time) and the good neighbor told her about the theft at that time. The detective said he had already spoken to her. She's probably the one who gave him my phone number.
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Are you sure he had $100K?
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ImageIMP, yes I'm sure.
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So glad to hear the authorities are investigating what's been going on. No need to worry that you might be accused of "parental neglect" or of some other sort of wrongdoing. The police aren't going around trying to arrest daughters of abusive dads who abandoned their families and who later fell victim to scam artists... They just aren't. That isn't happening anywhere. No need to fret about that! :)

Hopefully the state will step in to oversee his care and you will be able to step back a bit, emotionally. This has got to be so stressful for you!
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Thanks, Snoopy. You've brightened up my gloomy night. Yes, it has been very stressful, to say the least.

I want to thank everyone who has participated in this discussion. It's been more helpful than words can express. In fact, I don't know what I'd do without the people on this forum right now.
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