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My mother's financial adviser told her 3yrs ago "if she didn't stop spending money that she might have to do a reverse mortgage " but since then she has lowered her spending by 90% . At this time she doesn't need to do this loan. Plus our plans have changed to sell and move to Nevada within the next year. And I am moving in with her to help. We have met with 4 reverse mortgage agents, but this one lady has befriend my mom. Mom is lonely all her friends are gone. This agent is too friendly with mom. I have been told that it is not professional for an agent to act the way she is. Any suggestions?

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HI, KitKat124,

We all want to hear back from you. Are you reading all forum's ideas reached out to?
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is there any way you can get POA of your mothers financial matters? IF so......the "so-called" reverse mortgage agent can't do anything as you have the power then.  Also, I am sure there is someone that you can report her to, check with an elder attorney.  OR maybe better yet, meet with this woman by yourself and let her know that charges will be pressed for harassment of an elderly person.  I don't know all the fancy terminology but what that woman is wrong and shame on her for doing it.  She is only doing it because she will get a commission from the sale of it.  REPORT her.  good luck
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I am sure this "agent" works for a company. If so I would contact the company and tell them that she is crossing boundaries and that you wish her to no longer contact you (or mom)
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If something is too true to believe, it truly is. We readers are concerned; call the police and an attorney. Thank you and I also want to know!
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Dear KatKat124,

I feel like a lot of us succumb to "pressure" from any type of working professional be it a car salesman, bankers, life insurance agents etc. All we have to do is look at advertisements and see all the methods that are used.
Years ago, we almost did a reverse mortgage for my mom but, decided against it since we were not completely convinced it was a good or right thing to do.

You say she had lowered her spending by 90%, you plan to sell and move within the next year and you are moving in with her - sorry but, you don't need to do the loan. These people know how to "manipulate" others and they are "manipulating" you and your mother. The oldest trick in the book is to see a lonely, older person - befriend them and they think they have it in the bag. The woman agent should not be acting in this manner. That's exactly how my mom ended up doing a ten-year annuity without my knowledge which came up for renewal this year. Since I'm now her financial power of attorney, I called the company and said I wanted to cash out and I put it in her money market.

Please go with your intuition and remember you "NEVER, EVER" have to agree to anything that involves your own personal money/assets. This is their livelihood and therefore they are good at the "hard sell" at your expense (literally and figuratively speaking).

You need to firmly let them know you are in charge and in control of the situation. I would firmly say (with no apologies or explanations) you are no longer in need of or interested in doing a reverse mortgage but, thank you for your time. PERIOD! turn around, leave and don't go back. End of story. Good luck!
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Yes, would love to know how this worked out.
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AlvaDeer Jul 2020
I would love to know what KatKat decided on as well. Would love an update on this one.
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Is this agent calling? Block the number.

Also, by all means …. step up to the plate and be firm with this person. Tell this lady not to contact your mom any more. Tell her if she does, it is harrassment.

Some people try to take advantage of the most vulnerable. You got to put a stop to it.
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KitKat124,

Has advised actions been taken yet? We readers are looking out for your mother and you for all the best!
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Do not talk to this "agent" anymore. Still sounds like a scam. If still bothering you, call the police and report her phone number, address and the required license number, if available. This all should have been done by now.
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Hi- I am not sure how she is befriending your mom-is she calling? does she drop by?

I would write her an email (and CC her company boss in the email) and make it very clear that at this time your family plans are such and such and your mom is not interested in pursuing talks of reverse mortgage - if at some point in the future a reverse mortgage might be a good option we may contact your agency - thank you very much blah blah blah-and If she has any questions please direct them to your email - This lets her know that you see what's going on without being confrontational - and if she truly wants to be friends with your mom -great- just drop the reverse mortgage discussions----- that's not what friends talk about anyway
She is licensed and therefore must abide by the code of ethics from her board- if she continues to contact your mother after that then you may have to contact her board.
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Just want to know if this "thief" has yet been reported??
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I would immediately contact Adult Protective Services and the Office on Aging and alert them and ask for help. Also contact the police and possibly contact an eldercare attorney to step in. This is dangerous....I have seen too much of what can happen in cases like this. Do you have a Power of Attorney - if not, get one at once. Is there a company that this person is affiliated with that you can contact. Also, call your state representative/senator (congressman) as they can help.
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As a close person to your mum, you know they need to engage with others, meaning, she is in her right to choose friends of her like. BUT if you report the situation to the company and the authorities, that you welcome the friendship but this must not lead to a financial commitment of any kind, then I think is correct. It is your duty to shield her from scams or abuse. Hope that helps.
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Make a written complaint to both your state’s banking governance commission and your state’s council on aging. Do not make the complaint anonymous (you have to provide your name for it to be given the same priority/weight). Be aware that it may take them years to pursue an investigation. Due to their professional obligations and privacy laws, they will not be able to apprise you of the outcome.

Tell your mom that she is being scammed. Don’t be surprised when she expresses hurt, embarrassment and denial. Support her - she feels humiliated.

This woman’s “friendship” with your mom is inappropriate and manipulative. She surely has other victims that might not tell their family what is happening.

Thankfully you know about the situation.

This happened to my grandmother. She had stockbrokers coming to visit her in her home. They told her not to tell anybody. She lost her investment, of course. The statute of limitations on any lawsuit that could be filed had tolled when she finally discussed this with family. They could only be reported after the fact.
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I'd suggest you make a call to a local lawyer and ask where you stand legally, if your Mother refuses to dismiss the dishonest agent. What is the appropriate action steps to take
Trust your intuition. Intuition is the voice of life...direct. If you feel the agent is 'too friendly'...she is!
A lot of times "right information, wrong person" is the case. Meaning, your Mum may not listen to you.
However, if you get an outsider, perhaps a loving relative...or even better a female counsellor who preferably has experience with the elderly. Chose a warm person
Hospital systems have social & welfare workers . However, you might check with your medical insurance provider, they will have counsellors on their lists.
Rather a counsellor or therapist than a psychologist or psychiatrist
Then you could express your concerns, your goals for yourself and your Mother, and not least of all..your fears for your mothers safety & well being in every sense..including financially
A counselor could speak with both of you together. Listening is a learned skill. Professional counsellors (a good one) have this down to a fine art.
I would suggest considering a few sessions, and discussing what your Mothers hopes and plans are for the future...and Yours also :)
I admire your Mother's discipline by 'cutting spending by 90%'...wow, impressive.
He forgot to give your Mum clear definable goals. eg..a reasonable budget to clear her debts, save money, and have some quality of life.
So maybe she can have a budget which makes life more fun and enjoyable, while still taking care of her financial stability
Perhaps the counselor could assist in this area also, or recommend you to someone ethical who could
You might consider having your Mother write a 'bucket list' also.
One of my Grandma's favourite wise sayings was

"To be happy we have to have
something to do
something to look forward to
And, someone to love"

My Grandfather resents me "telling him what to do"
However, I keep on loving him (even when i can't stand his annoying attitude :) & doing the things I hope a loved one might do for me when Im elderly...
I found out about a senior center in his area where they have many classes and courses. He started going and it has helped his outlook a Lot.
Not such a 'glum chum' now. Mostly he likes to 'hang out & shoot pool with a guys' there. Wasn't too keen on the classes :) Sounds like back in high school at 84 !
He has something to look forward to
There may be a group in your Mothers area she could join. There are many groups online now while we are on lockdown. Writers groups, groups that watch & discuss old movies, groups that discuss cooking, flower arranging, knitting, all sorts of hobby groups. Im sure with a little research & patience you could find one that would put a smile on your Mothers face.
Lastly, i hope your Mother realizes how really lucky she is to have you looking out for her and loving her.
My apologies this is wordy
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Do not be personal with this crazy RM agent. If you are still getting more requests, block the agent's phone number and emails on yours and your Mom's devices. Call the Law Enforcement Officers, or the police. Please do not fall victims. Again, report incidents to the FTC and BBB. Get that POA by tomorrow. One day late may mean one day too late.
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"...keeps telling Mom that there is 0 interest and it will cost her nothing...nothing."

What a scam artist this woman is! It DOES cost, which I'm sure you are aware of. If not, or for others interested, just like ANY mortgage, there are FEES to process the damn loan!

"The origination fee covers a lender's operating expenses associated with originating the reverse mortgage. A lender can charge the greater of $2,500 or 2% of the first $200,000 of your home's value plus 1% of the amount over $200,000. HECM origination fees are capped at $6,000."

Plus, they use a calculator to determine how much of the value you can take - it is NOT guaranteed that you would get the whole current value of the home as factors like age are used.

Even more scary is having someone who is overspending being told by a financial advisor that they may need a RM if they keep this up - for those who don't have help and/or can't curtail their spending (kudos to you for getting mom's habits changed! not easy when dementia is at play.), they could continue spending and waste ALL the funds from the RM!!! The primary reason I can think for considering this (last resort) is to stay in one's own home and have funds to pay for care. Otherwise, RMs are a potentially dangerous beast!

"She sent the RM agent an email and told her mom didn't need a RM ..period. the agent said she would cancel the paperwork that mom keeps putting on hold. I pray this is the end."

Hopefully that quashed this woman's overzealous attempts to coerce your mother into signing for an RM! BUT, I would not just pray - I would follow up on it with the person you contacted, to be sure mom's off the "to do" list. If mom is still living alone in her home, can you set up a camera, to monitor who comes/goes? Sounds like your mother is somewhat gullible and if this person keeps coming around, I would take the next step and threaten legal action.

Hopefully you do have all the POA paperwork done - if so, I would remove all check books and let her have one small limit CC or debit card, if she insists (try to work with her and keep these with you, but she can still use them when you are there.)

"But she sees on TV Tom Selleck selling RM and she thinks if she does a RM she will meet him. SCARY"

On one hand, that is just so cute and sweet. On the other, yes it IS very scary! How many other little old ladies are sucked into that "dream" or any number of others?

As to your other comments:
"...she would be moving for 5yrs."
"Mom is so confused she told me a week ago that she has not talked to her Granddaughter in 4yrs , when she just talked to her a month ago and 4 other times since December."

These are some of the hallmarks of early dementia stages. Losing concept of time, repetition, forgetfulness (more than just where did I leave my damn keys!) I highly recommend learning all you can while you can, esp before this move. There are many sites (alz org or this site among others) that list the stages and the common symptoms. Knowing what you to expect is very beneficial. There are no hard and fast rules about what symptoms and which stages, each person has their own journey, but being aware of what might come along is SO helpful! I was totally unaware of all that goes on, and started learning all I could when mom was similar to your mom now. It did help, but I still had more to learn. For instance, UTIs can cause odd behavior, like sun-downing. In mom's case, she had that once, but now it shows up as night time bed wetting! Any sudden change in demeanor, suspect UTI - easy and cheap to test for and treatment will usually resolve the issues. Also, since she's already having early signs, beware that your move with her can disorient her and possibly cause some additional memory loss (one reason we often recommend a single move to MC AL rather than AL then MC.)

Hopefully the RM lady has exited your mom's orbit, never to return! Best of luck with your move and future care-giving!
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GET A POWER OF ATTORNEY
ASAP!!!

My brother tried taking my moms house and all her assets without my knowing. Mom doesnt have the education but of a 4th grader, so he took advantage of that. The attorney who signed the POA and the will should be shot.
All has since been rectified and as it should be.

My point is, dont assume your mom will do the right thing. People can coerce her and she will think shes doing the right thing.

Also, if this person is employed by such a bank to whatever, you need to report this person. NOW!
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KatKat124: Anyone with dementia should NOT be making these type of decisions. Also, you need to obtain DPoA as soon as is possible.
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You need communication skills that will get your mother into what is best for both of you. It sounds like in your narative you are appropriate in your goals for yourself and your mother. It she is in the next move...a reverse morgage does not look wise. She will be selling in future and move with you. Or she will be buying. Be present when you meet with this person and remember this person wants to sell your mother and make money off of her. You need first of all to get your mother on the "same page" so to speak as you and be together with a goal that she and you both want. Then the re-verse mortgage person will be out of the plan.
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KitKat, oh my FG! “She sees Tom Selleck on TV and thinks she’s going to meet him” (if she gets a RM).

Please please reread everyone’s posts, make notes as to suggestions and find a elder law atty to update your moms legal and try to get her bank accounts as POD/ TOD to you ASAP.

Listen we get it, all of us have in some way had to deal with a parent who isn’t competent and cognitive. As Alva posted, it sounds like she’s on the cusp of competency. You have to get stuff done while she’s still somewhat able to appear competent and cognitive. If that means she goes to the beauty shoppe on Tuesday and then to attys office on Wednesday between 9-11 as she’s still perky then & looking good, it’s what you gotta do. She need to be able to show some competency.

If she’s been target by grifters once, it’s likely to happen again.

My mom had Lewy Body Dementia and could carry on a reasonable conversation for the 3-10 minutes most folks stop to chat in. She was still good on the ADLs & knew how to coordinate her wardrobe and did weekly beauty shoppe. She had decades of being very social to kick in to autopilot. But if you really talked with her beyond a few minutes, she was in another solar system filled with false beliefs. Thankfully her legal, banking, codicil was all done way way before she moved into a NH. You can’t wait on stuff as the bank will likely want her to sit in a bank officers office on her own to verify that whatever’s being changed is what she wants to do. If you take her to SSA office, they will do this too.

Really for her own safety and security, and your own sanity, get with an atty to review her legal and do whatever fresh needed & soon.
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AlvaDeer Jul 2020
Hopefully someone will inform her that Tom is a gay man with a loving partner. That might end the daydream.
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I have to agree with Alva, do it thru a lawyer. Just makes it more legal. And you are assured you have covered all bases. I think Alva's cost is a little steep but I haven't been involved with be assigned POA in over 10 yrs.
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AlvaDeer Jul 2020
California, don't you know! And Southern California, at that! I think other places may be a good deal more reasonable, JoAnn. I would BET on it.
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Hi, you can go on line to legalzoom.com and print out a POA form then you and your Mom go to her bank fill it out and have it notarized.
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AlvaDeer Jul 2020
Pinky I think I would opt for a POA done now by lawyer. The wording is SO important, and there are times you will walk in with your legal zoom and the "language" is deemed not good enough. The signature witnessed by a notary is not the same as a lawyer asking if Mom knows what she is doing. This Mom is on the cusp of not being able to function in future to do this. I think it is important to get legal paperwork done correctly. For my brother and I the cost was about 3,000.00 but I consider it the best money he and I invested to get us where we had to be with everything.
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Dear, KitKat124:
Please take our forum readers' suggested action ASAP with POA, etc. now, before your mother's situation becomes an expensive emergency. Do not fall for and be taken advantage of these apparent scam-type requests. I would like to know how your mother's concerned outcome safely works out, but that sharing is your mother's and your option. Thank you for reaching out to Agingcare for our advice!
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Make sure you have POA over her health & finances— before your Moms health deteriorates!You will be glad you did down the road!
I certainly am glad I had this done for my sister who has Alzheimer’s!
I am the only family my sister has! I had to give my sisters home back to the bank - she had a reverse mortgage & her hubby had died so I had to take matter into making sure my sister had the care she needed!I had to empty her home & pay her bills that she had not paid for the last 6 months! It has been nine yrs ago ! My sister just turned 76 & is in a nursing home & no longer knows me! She is well taken care of! I’m glad
now that having POA came with no instances!
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AlvaDeer Jul 2020
I so agree that you must go to an Elder Law Attorney now WITH Mom and get financial POA for her to protect her, and POA for Health care WHILE SHE CAN do this. She will soon not be competent to do it. You can then get guardianship, but more costly and more time consuming and if Mom objected she would have a lawyer appointed. It is time to see Elder Law Attorney so that all the ducks are in a row. When my bro was diagnosed with probably early Lewy's Dementia he ASKED me to become his POA for financial, take over his bills and assets and to be the Trustee of his Trust. He was well enough to be able to do that, thank god.
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Please have a discussion with this agent. Explain that your mom is not totally mentally competent. Explain that you would prefer her to go through you and not your mother. Explain that if she does not stop calling your mother, you will place a restraining order on her and report her to the BBB.
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Once she signs, it will be a legal quagmire bear to undo it. I would move her to your home until you are ready to move to hers. I would talk to the agent's company top management about their agent trying to scam your mom and demand they stay away from her. Call the police as well. FILE A POLICE REPORT. If your mom signs that will help. I'm telling you once she signs it will be very expensive to undo it. Make certain you have POA.
REVERSE MORTGAGE is a mess.
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I think the Federal Trade Commission may help here if you need to file a complaint.

"The purpose of the FTC is to enforce the provisions of the Federal Trade Commission Act, which prohibits "unfair or deceptive acts or practices in commerce." The Clayton Antitrust Act (1914) also granted the FTC the authority to act against specific and unfair monopolistic practices"
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If this RM harrassment continues, please report it to the BBB. With dementia and Alzheimer's, your mother is incomptent. Also, insure no scam activity is happening.
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cetude Jul 2020
I would report it to the company's upper management and demand they stop harassing the mother and file a police report.
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Kat Kat, given what the RM agent is telling your Mom, so misleading, and given your Mom's understanding of it, it is time now to write the company this "person" is involved with and putting them on notice that your Mother is being "befriended" by a woman PUSHING Reverse Mortage to her, and if this continues you will consider this to be elder abuse and you will be requesting an investigation into the company's practices be opened. Then send a letter to the woman. Tell her that if her friendship again descends down the rabbit hole of advising your Mom financially to open a RM, you will file a suit for elder abuse against her and her company. Tell her that her friendship needs to have ZERO advice or mention of financial matter; that those matters are not under the definition of "friendship". Keep a diary of everything that happens. You say you are moving with Mom and will be her POA. It would be a very good thing if you can take this over, keep meticulous records of income and output, and be the lioness at the gate for those attempting to take advantage of your Mom. It is sounding as though your Mom is knowing that handling these financial things now is not going well. I hope she will turn things over to you so that you can protect her. A RM in future may be a good thing to help her remain in her home if that is her wish. Time will tell. Keep your own finances separate from Mom's going forward.
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